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Allen MOS organ home now and the adventure begins!

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  • jbird604
    commented on 's reply
    RE: the noisy key returns... I hear that in the video, but haven't noticed it when playing. I think my phone camera picked up that noise more efficiently than it did the organ sound itself, which seems rather distant in the video.

    This old MOS console started out in a local church, then it went into a private home, then another church, then into a garage, was hauled to the shop on an open trailer, and from there to my house. Five different homes, and some of them (like my shop) have been sort of grungy and humid. So it's a wonder the keyboard felt isn't in worse shape. I'm also surprised that I don't have any key contact troubles, as I have found on some old MOS organs. Main issue is that the touch weight is still too low, even after I tightened the springs a little.

  • myorgan
    commented on 's reply
    John,

    I did miss one thing I noticed in the video. Listen to it again when you let up on the Swell keys. I know you're keeping the console for the keyboards, for one, but are the key returns quiet enough for you?

    Michael

    P.S. I still haven't heard that 32' Reed yet. Still in storage until I can get my garage done this summer.

  • jbird604
    commented on 's reply
    There is a "chiff" tab in the swell on MOS-1 organs, and it is a strange little sound that I don't find very useful. Yes, on MOS-1 the chiff is in fact just another "stop" like the rest, and can be played alone, though of course there isn't any reason to do that. I suppose it could be used with a module sound, but the module sounds all have their own very nice attack transients.

    It's funny that even the old analog Allens had some interesting chiff sounds, which they produced by simply keying a pitch so many semi-tones above with a very quick percussive attack and decay. But when MOS came out, chiff became this corny little "whoosh" noise that doesn't sound like anything I've ever heard an organ do!

    MOS-2 greatly improved on chiff, as most models had custom chiff samples in the EPROMs, and the chiff was available on all appropriate stops, not just in the swell.

    I thought you'd like that 32' reed You sure wanted one for a long time before one came along for you.

    The Ahlborn module also has a Plein Jeu IV-V in the swell division, which I didn't demo here. It too is rather high pitched. But both the Ahlborn and the Content have far better mixtures than the MOS, as the MOS mixtures just turn into a jangling distorted mess when used in full organ. Of course the bane of MOS was always how the stops sounded good by themselves but somehow failed to fuse well or became muddy and thick in combinations.

    Thanks for the comments!

  • myorgan
    commented on 's reply
    I loved the 32' Pedal Reed, John!

    Thank you so much for comparing these sounds. Does the MOS have a separate Chiff stop, and can it be added to one of the module sounds that doesn't have Chiff? If I recall correctly, the Chiff makes its own sound on either MOS-1 or MOS-2.
    I'm wondering what that would sound like.

    Again, thank you, John for doing this.

    Michael

    P.S. The Cymbal III is definitely brighter than the Fourniture IV–it's the nature of the stop composition.

  • jbird604
    replied
    Ok, Back to the mix of MOS and the modules... Here's a video to try to compare similar stops among the three sources. Not much real music here, just some stop sounds for you to check out, a little snippet of hymn playing toward the end. I used NO REVERB at all, so the bare sounds are more detectable, though I don't normally try to practice without reverb. To me, the dry sound is not interesting or appealing enough to make me want to play very much. (The Content module has a built-in reverb of its own which is not fully defeatable, so you may hear a little lingering on some of its sounds.)

    Note that there hasn't been any voicing or adjusting done to either module, beyond simply matching the overall level of each one to approximate the MOS level, for comparison purposes. The Ahlborn does have quite a bit of voicing capability, including leveling each stop. The Content allows adjustment of the wind sag, chorus and tuning offsets, etc., but these are all set to minimum for purposes of evaluation.

    Honestly, I see that the MOS has very little to contribute in this mix, and that just the two modules would make a pretty decent organ when combined. As we all noted earlier, this combination would lack certain things, such as a true Cornet, that we might miss. I also would miss having my Krummhorn on the great, so it can be played against the swell celestes. But this is just an interim solution as I plod along toward a full VPO conversion.


    Leave a comment:


  • mutti_wilson
    commented on 's reply
    I don't know how HW works, but everything in Grand Orgue can also be mapped to a keyboard key as well. So once your generals/divisionals are setup you can use 1,2,3 etc to switch between them. I have a touchscreen now, but my new piston rails will essentially be keyboard inputs. My organ only has 4 midi configurable generals so it's very limited. I'll also be wiring my toe pistons into my "keyboard" as well. They won't be lighted but that's fine.

  • tbeck
    commented on 's reply
    John, you don't need a touch screen at all. I use a regular monitor and and mouse. Granted, it isn't a great solution, but I set up my combinations in sequence and just use a controller for the "next" button on the sequencer. The monitor displays the stops appropriately. And, as you say, you can control them with the pistons as well.

  • mutti_wilson
    replied
    You can run Grand Orgue for free and get any set from Piotr Grabowski and you'll be running. You don't need to jump into HW right off the bat if you don't want to.

    Leave a comment:


  • jbird604
    commented on 's reply
    LOL! I agree, Larry. It is inevitable. And everything I'm doing now is making way for the VPO. Even removing the stop rail is part of my VPO plan, and then I plan to carve out a portion of the top lid and relocate the music desk. I've always wanted to have my music right down in front of me, sitting just above the top manual, and it's more important than ever since I've lost some range of motion and strength in my arms the past few years.

    Today I removed the music rack and placed the two modules where it was. No place for my music now, but at least I can reach the controls for all three tone sources. It's sort of fun being able to mix and match these different stops. But this is only a stopgap measure on the way to my VPO.

    I had a thought today -- once I get the pistons installed that I ordered from China, and wire them to a simple encoder, I could run Hauptwerk using just the pistons. I wouldn't immediately have to buy a new computer with a touch-screen. So, one step at a time...

  • AllenAnalog
    replied
    I know you are waiting on implementing Hauptwerk until you have something better than your current laptop but I still think trying it with the free sample sets on that machine will propel you to ditch the hardware TGs in your system.

    Resistance is futile.

    Leave a comment:


  • jbird604
    commented on 's reply
    Michael, I know you love "comparison" recordings, so I'm planning to do one, perhaps tomorrow, if I can get the time. I re-connected the MOS outputs to the mixer tonight just so I could hear all three sound sources in A/B/C style. The side by side comparisons are interesting, and I hope to be able to share some of that. What I can't compare to these three is a real VPO of course, but the contrasts among MOS, Content, and Ahlborn are fun to hear.

  • myorgan
    commented on 's reply
    You should be a politician, John! Bait-and-switch topics. How dare you?!!!

    This is a very interesting topic, and wherever it ends up, I'll be reading it with great interest with the future of my instruments in mind. You're providing lots of useful information!

    Michael

  • jbird604
    commented on 's reply
    I hadn't really realized how much the thread is drifting toward being about a VPO. At this point, I still have a midi-fied old clunker organ supplemented by a pair of outdated tone generator modules! But once it becomes an actual VPO, I'll need to move the documenting of it over there. Thanks, everybody!

  • myorgan
    commented on 's reply
    Originally posted by mutti_wilson
    Thanks for documenting your project. Any reason you aren't doing this in the Virtual Organ section?
    Yes, there is. The thread didn't start out as a VPO thread. If John wants it moved, as a moderator, he can move it.

    Michael

  • tbeck
    commented on 's reply
    I'm considering a MIDIfication project. I wish I had your skills!
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