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Hopefully a Good One!

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  • Hopefully a Good One!

    Well tomorrow (Sat.) I will be picking up my first Allen organ (free!!)! Its a 301B given to me by a church whose worship style has changed making the organ obsolete. :-( Anyway, they tell me that it's in excellent working order and was always serviced/maintained. There are speakers with this organ that I will need to get down from either side of the baptismal....they didn't have a clue what kind or what model. This organ should be a big step up from my Conn 716 and 717....I hope. In reliability....the Conns were too much of a frustration to have any enjoyment out of. Any comments about this particular organ or suggestions would be much appreciated........TBC

  • #2
    MOS I from about 1978. Single computer, two 100 watt amplifiers.
    Open it up and make sure all the power supplies and amps are screwed down before you move it. I've come across serviced organs where they just leave things loose.
    Speakers could be HC-10, #16 or even a gyro was offered for that model. Either way- heavy. Grab any AV cards too for safe keeping.
    Let us know what you end up with.

    td
    Servicing electronic organs since 1969.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by tucsondave View Post
      MOS I from about 1978. Single computer, two 100 watt amplifiers.
      Open it up and make sure all the power supplies and amps are screwed down before you move it. I've come across serviced organs where they just leave things loose.
      Dave,

      You are so right! When I picked up my ADC-5400, I didn't think to check the amps, and only discovered one was loose when I got home (1600 miles later). Fortunately one side of the amp was still anchored, but it served as a reminder. If I forget, I can always look at the scraping on the inside of the back of the organ to remind me.:'(

      Michael
      Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
      • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
      • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
      • 11 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 7 Pianos

      Comment


      • #4
        Just a tiny correction... I sold MOS-1 Allens 40-41 years ago.
        The 301 came out in 1973. It used HC speakers-- the open-back Gyros, etc. were used with the 300 (and 200 etc) earlier models until, I guess, Allen used up their stock of tone cabinets from the analog days. Also, the amps at that point were T-50 50-watt.
        It was a good organ... read John Birdsong's comments about the MOS-1 organs.
        R, Bill Miller Phila PA

        Originally posted by tucsondave View Post
        MOS I from about 1978. Single computer, two 100 watt amplifiers.
        Open it up and make sure all the power supplies and amps are screwed down before you move it. I've come across serviced organs where they just leave things loose.
        Speakers could be HC-10, #16 or even a gyro was offered for that model. Either way- heavy. Grab any AV cards too for safe keeping.
        Let us know what you end up with.

        td

        Comment


        • #5
          Build date could certainly be earlier and of course the original customer had choices.
          You are right that gyros were standard with 300 but looks like you could still get one for the 301
          At least it doesn't have NAR capture!

          Servicing electronic organs since 1969.

          Comment


          • #6
            Ok Picked up the 301B this morning....a pretty straight forward procedure...organ dollies on organ roll to trailer load tie down. Speakers were another thing. Above the baptismal which is rear center stage about 17 feet up....small cupboard door like opening. I'm not sure what allen speakers these are... I just know all the woofer surrounds are missing. Midrange and tweeters look good and healthy though. Organ console cleaned up real nice! You can tell they took care of this organ. This 301b was bought and delivered in Dec. 1979 and installed in this church and is/was the original owners. They also gave me a file with all the purchase records. The pics are here....
            http://www.organforum.com/forums/album.php?albumid=303
            I haven't opened it up yet neither have I fired her up yet either....although the church insists that it was working when they retired it quite a few years back.....More to follow........

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Hamman View Post
              I'm not sure what allen speakers these are... I just know all the woofer surrounds are missing. Midrange and tweeters look good and healthy though.
              [snip]
              I haven't opened it up yet neither have I fired her up yet either....although the church insists that it was working when they retired it quite a few years back.....More to follow........
              I'm sure you know this already, but please don't fire 'er up with the surrounds missing on the speakers. You can damage them by playing them too loud or too low. The added excursion can damage the spider. I get my woofer surrounds replaced for around $35.00, but it might be a bit more expensive where you live.

              I've never seen those speakers before, so they might be the HC-10 speakers I've heard of, but have never seen (according to the schematic posted earlier). The two speakers with just the woofer are probably the speakers for the 32' channels in the pedal.

              Congratulations on your acquisition, and may you enjoy the organ for many years to come!

              Michael

              P.S. Also check for batteries being corroded inside on the boards. Just snip them off if they are corroded.
              Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
              • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
              • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
              • 11 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 7 Pianos

              Comment


              • #8
                Opened up the back of the 301B yesterday and looked around...... very clean lay out......absolutely no signs of mice or other rodents living in there :-) . All the amps (3) were nicely screwed down...thank God since I didn't check before moving. One amp, (Flutes), has 3 inputs running to it with 2 outputs. The second amp (Main) just had 1 input with one output. Both those amps are mounted on the bottom floor of the console. The 3rd amp (bass) is mounted up on the upper side of the right (facing rear) side of the organ. It also has just one input and one output. All the wiring is clearly marked and well tied off. All the outputs from all three of these amps run up to a relay board with about 5 or 6 relays (marked "computer relay") So I'm guessing the tab switches on the front operate these relays. Circuitry on the boards looks light years ahead of the electronic age of that time (1979)! Will be repairing the woofers this week so I can get this organ up and running!
                ....myorgan, where would those batteries be located and what kind are they? When I tried the organ out through some self powered Alesis studio monitors, I did notice that the "set" for the preset action would not hold. All the presets just activate all the stop tabs across the board...but the cancel works. Wouldn't the "set" work and hold the preset as long as the organ was receiving power from the PS to operate this circuit?
                One other thing....I need the key to the memory "A-B" switch...any ideas?

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'm not sure what you mean by your description of the "set" not holding. This isn't supposed to be a preset system, but a user programmable combination action. You set the tabs you want on a numbered piston, then while pressing on the set piston, you press the numbered piston where you want the combination stored, and then release the numbered piston then release the set piston. To recall that setting, press the numbered piston you chose and release. Stops should move accordingly, on and off.

                  The A/B memory switch key is likely the same as the roll-top or fall-board lock. If it is, then you can have it duplicated at your local locksmith.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Toodles, thats how I did try to set the preset(s). When I went back to try...no bueno.....so I meant to say that the memory for the preset circuit is not working or the actual set button is not working. Do you know where the batteries are for this circuit?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      The DM capture system used its own 5 volt power supply. Look for a cage about 6x8x6 inches. It has 4 1.2 volt "D" size nicads inside.
                      Those will have to be replaced.

                      The key you can probably get from Allen Organ Co.

                      td
                      Servicing electronic organs since 1969.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hamman,

                        Tuscondave has more accurate information than I. I know that on my MOS-II, it is on a DM-3 board (the largest board in the organ), and is a dual-battery pack wrapped in plastic. I don't remember what sort of DM board the MOS-I had. Either way, it may need to be replaced, and standard practice is to run wires to the floor of the organ and mount the batteries there. That way, if they corrode, they don't compromise anything important.
                        Originally posted by Hamman View Post
                        Toodles, thats how I did try to set the preset(s). When I went back to try...no bueno.....so I meant to say that the memory for the preset circuit is not working or the actual set button is not working. Do you know where the batteries are for this circuit?
                        If I remember right, the MOS-I 301 had a sequential capture action. That means that when you press the piston, the stop tabs change in a series of 3-4 "clunks" or groups. Allen quickly figured out that sort of combination action wasn't convenient for quick changes. When the batteries went in that combination action, approximately 1/2 of each division would go down, while the other 1/2 would go up--as if it were the default neutral state. I'm sure once you get the batteries replaced, the organ will behave better.

                        Hope this is helpful to you.

                        Michael
                        Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
                        • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
                        • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
                        • 11 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 7 Pianos

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The A-B capture key is different from the console lock key. open the top lid of the console and see if there are spare keys screwnailed to the top right hand side of the hinge rail ( looking at the organ from the keyboards) My 603 had the spares there and it appeared it had been done from at least the original install.

                          Chris

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thanks Chris, I'll check that out tonight. That would be awesome if there were some spares there. I have already contacted Allen Organ via e-mail with no response yet. I have just finished repairing my speakers so I will be hooking them up tonight!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Well, I've seen a LOT of Allen organ speakers in my career, but those are new to me. Could be some variation of the HC-10. I've only seen a handful of organs equipped with the HC-10, which I suspect was a transitional design. It was the first sealed-box speaker from Allen and was quickly superseded by the HC-12 (with which we are all familiar).

                              The HC-10 speakers I've seen all had the familiar foam-surround 15" woofer and the phenolic-ring tweeter, but instead of the set of four mid-ranges in yours, there was a single fairly large mid-range driver, perhaps about 8" or so. I think it was a Wilder driver and had a sealed back, but not a "cup" as the more recent sealed midranges do.

                              Apparently, in the original setup your organ had two of the HC-10 (?) boxes on each primary channel plus two of the bass cabinets on the bass channel. Probably had a huge sound and filled the church well. Really a shame that they abandoned it, no doubt for a "praise team."

                              You're lucky to have found a MOS organ in such good condition. It should serve you well for many years to come. We still get them traded in and we clean them up, do minor repairs, and put them into new homes. Never have any problems with them. I am convinced the MOS was the most stable and reliable system ever used for a digital organ, far more reliable than many of the later technologies. Not as realistic in some ways, but amazingly good compared to the old analogs, and with many of the advantages of digital, such as tuning and voicing.

                              There are several things that could cause the capture action not to work, none of them easily diagnosed from afar. Try setting a "blank" piston and see what happens. If stops go down even with you holding the SET piston in, the SET piston itself may be bad. Of course, the DM board (capture memory) can be bad, and the Capture Power Supply is far more than just a power supply, containing a very elaborate pulsed multi-channel distribution system, so it can have problems too, and these are hard to diagnose without an extensive knowledge of how it works.

                              Once I published on this forum a rather extensive explanation of the DM capture system and a troubleshooting guide for pinpointing malfunctions. It might be something you could find if you search.

                              Congratulations and good luck!
                              John
                              ----------
                              *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!

                              https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

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