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  • Allen Genisys Voices

    Saw the video for the new on-board "Alternate Voices" from Allen.

    Hasn't AG been doing this since the late 90s, and Rodgers in late 2000s?

    http://youtu.be/FOJ4Zi6-Ilg

    I like it, but it certainly isn't breaking the "one stop one voice barrier." That was done some time ago...

    And, what about Vista? With this new addition, is there any reason to get the external MIDI unit?
    Allen MOS 1105 (1982)
    Allen ADC 5000 (1985) w/ MDS Expander II (drawer unit)
    Henry Reinich Pipe 2m/29ranks (1908)

  • #2
    Well, this is brand new to me! Must get on the Allen site and try to get more details. I can see some tremendous possibilities here. It appeared from the brief glimpses that there would be perhaps two of these "Genisys" tabs in each division, and each one can have a different assigned sound. So far, that sounds a bit like the old Card Reader ("alterables") or like what you can do when you have an Allen MIDI Expander attached to an Allen organ, which is to set up different MIDI sounds on each division, and recall them with the pistons.

    But this appears to go a little further. I saw a screen that seemed to let you alter a number of parameters on the voices, even the tuning for the individual patches, as well as level and maybe some other stuff. That sounds pretty interesting, and is something that can't be done, at least not easily, with the existing Expander modules. It's possible that the Vista module already allows some of this type of editing, but I don't have much experience with it.

    At any rate, this looks like a nice new feature, which I assume will be incorporated right into the Console Controller, not requiring a bulky additional device in a drawer. And it ought to be more intuitive, as each "Genisys" tab will function exactly like another stop tab, except that you get to create a custom stop any time you wish.

    While this might seem similar to what other companies have offered, I can see some unique possibilities. As is often the case, Allen appears to have taken a good idea and made it more user-friendly.

    - - - Updated - - -

    A quick look at the Allen Organ Co website shows no mention of this new system. Since it's May, I wonder if they are having their annual dealer meeting in Macungie, and this is a new feature being introduced to the dealers.

    I sure hope they make this a standard feature of even the small models. Sure would be a boon to the players.
    John
    ----------
    *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!

    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by organman95 View Post
      Hasn't AG been doing this since the late 90s, and Rodgers in late 2000s?
      Organman,

      Maybe, but I'm sure Allen will do it better!;-)

      Originally posted by organman95 View Post
      Saw the video for the new on-board "Alternate Voices" from Allen.
      If Allen knows how to do one thing, it is how to take existing technology and making it more user-friendly. That's not to say they haven't made foibles some of their choices, but they tend to do it right. I just hope they chose to use new samples!

      Michael
      Way too many organs to list, but I do have 5 Allens:
      • MOS-2 Model 505-B / ADC-4300-DK / ADC-5400 / ADC-6000 (Symphony) / ADC-8000DKC
      • Lowrey Heritage (DSO-1)
      • 11 Pump Organs, 1 Pipe Organ & 7 Pianos

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by myorgan View Post
        If Allen knows how to do one thing, it is how to take existing technology and making it more user-friendly. That's not to say they haven't made foibles some of their choices, but they tend to do it right. I just hope they chose to use new samples!

        Michael
        I don't find the Genisys controller to be as user friendly as the old console controller... What was the reason for the design change?
        Allen MOS 1105 (1982)
        Allen ADC 5000 (1985) w/ MDS Expander II (drawer unit)
        Henry Reinich Pipe 2m/29ranks (1908)

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by organman95 View Post
          I don't find the Genisys controller to be as user friendly as the old console controller... What was the reason for the design change?
          Some blurb from a recent Allen Newsletter:
          "...The result is the new GeniSys™ console control system, described by engineers as "hardware-agnostic". That doesn't mean the software can't decide whether or not it believes in hardware, it means that the software isn't limited to only one type of hardware. With sustainable GeniSys Technology, today's Allen organs can take advantage of tomorrow's innovations. And, as hardware evolves, service parts can become upgrades instead of mere replacements."

          For those of us (me included) who have not tried it out, Allen have uploaded a recent Genisys User Manual:
          http://www.allenorgan.com/www/suppor...33-00225-1.pdf

          Perhaps I have misunderstood it but Genisys Alternate Voices doesn't seem as groundbreaking as they make it out to be. It seems to me, rightly or wrongly, that it does pretty much what the old Expander/Ensemble/Vista unit did but in an integrated format (no separate unit required sitting on the console) that has been made a bit easier to use i.e. assigning to stops. Doesn't this product largely overlap the touch-screen Vista Navigator as well?
          1971 Allen Organ TC-3S (#42904) w/sequential capture system.
          Speakers: x1 Model 100 Gyro, x1 Model 105 & x3 Model 108.

          Comment


          • #6
            It may in fact be no more useful than the Vista, but it is a step ahead of the previous line of expanders, in that you can easily adjust the tuning and the level of each patch individually. My expander only lets me adjust the overall tuning of the entire device, and to set the volume only with one knob that controls all the sounds.

            Also, I think putting a pair of "Genisys Voice" tabs in each division makes it much more intuitive, very much like in MOS days, when you had a couple (or more) "Alterable" tabs in each division. So the "Genisys" division is not such much a floating division (as is the case with the expander voices) as it is a way of adding unique new stops to each division at will.

            Remember, I haven't actually seen one of these, nor have I played around with a Vista, except very briefly on a service call, so I'm not giving authoritative advice here. It just looks to me like a very good idea, and as noted, it gets rid of the extra drawer underneath the keydesk.

            If I had a million dollars right now ...
            John
            ----------
            *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!

            https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

            Comment


            • #7
              Nullogik,

              I think you are correct in saying that this is not really a ground breaking move on Allen's part.

              What it does do though is bring their organs up to date in terms of features and compared to what the competition is or has had for awhile. No doubt this move has future developments and organs in mind.

              I see their MIDI now has local off, so for instance they can turn of an on board stop and replace it with a say a Hauptwerk stop.

              I see quite a number of borrowed ideas from Ahlborn-Galanti and Johannus. Possibly ideas came from other companies as well.

              In the video they do not mention that the organ actually sounds better.

              AV

              Comment


              • #8
                I heard it live. Many of the samples have been changed - for the (much) better. This is not MIDI in any way. Controls consist of volume, key shift, tuning, and key limits. There are two assignable voices per division. They all couple via the organ couplers. Working the unit is quite simple and easy to understand.
                Allen Q285D

                Comment


                • #9
                  Good to hear. I just think (based on my experience) the old CC was more friendly in terms of moving around windows and selections. I have only played with the current (with rotary dial) once. By chance are the pipe samples better as well? I haven't been too impressed with those either.
                  Allen MOS 1105 (1982)
                  Allen ADC 5000 (1985) w/ MDS Expander II (drawer unit)
                  Henry Reinich Pipe 2m/29ranks (1908)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The video (around the 1:30 mark) seems to imply that there are more than single organ stops. It talked about a string chorus at one point and maybe a reed chorus.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      John, they had a dealer meeting in Dallas last week and unveiled this, but in usual Allen fashion, have not updated the website at all with the GeniSys voices or the new model numbers.
                      It is my understanding that the smaller chancel models can have it added as an option, but that it will be standard on Bravura and custom instruments. While they may say this is not MIDI, it has the exact same general MIDI voices and organ voices that were offered in the Ensemble and Vista units.
                      I do also see some potential with the ability to make adjustments that were mentioned to the voices, and the fact that they will couple is also an improvement.
                      Bryan
                      =÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=
                      Magnus Europa, 4 manuals, 112 stops - church sanctuary
                      Hauptwerk 3 manual, converted from Rodgers 330 - home
                      Rodgers Allegiant 677- church chapel

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bbierbaum View Post
                        John, they had a dealer meeting in Dallas last week and unveiled this, but in usual Allen fashion, have not updated the website at all with the GeniSys voices or the new model numbers.
                        It is my understanding that the smaller chancel models can have it added as an option, but that it will be standard on Bravura and custom instruments. While they may say this is not MIDI, it has the exact same general MIDI voices and organ voices that were offered in the Ensemble and Vista units.
                        I do also see some potential with the ability to make adjustments that were mentioned to the voices, and the fact that they will couple is also an improvement.
                        The Allen site does, however, mention Genisys on the models that have it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          They mention the GeniSys controller, which was introduced last year. What is new is the GeniSys voices.
                          Bryan
                          =÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=÷=
                          Magnus Europa, 4 manuals, 112 stops - church sanctuary
                          Hauptwerk 3 manual, converted from Rodgers 330 - home
                          Rodgers Allegiant 677- church chapel

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Allen have released another Genisys Voices video where Barry Holben demonstrates it in more detail:



                            A full list of voices can be found here:
                            http://www.allenorgan.com/www/produc...sVoiceList.pdf

                            Here is a new bullet point summary of both Genisys Voices and Genisys Controller:
                            http://www.allenorgan.com/www/produc...ideodisplay/1/

                            The model numbers have been tweaked and a few more added. Previously the Bravura range topped out with a four manual, now there is a new five manual L-563. Genisys Voices is standard on Bravura L-124 model upwards and optional on the larger Chancel models.
                            1971 Allen Organ TC-3S (#42904) w/sequential capture system.
                            Speakers: x1 Model 100 Gyro, x1 Model 105 & x3 Model 108.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Quite impressive! (If that's what you want to do with an organ...)
                              John
                              ----------
                              *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!

                              https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

                              Comment

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