Rodgers console construction quality? Johannus?

[Dewey643]

Has anybody seen the insides of any new Rodgers(or even Johannus)organ recently to see how they are constructed? It is subpar at best,..if I can use that term. I was sent photos on Facebook of the insides of two Rodgers organs,..and the quality of construction is horrendous. To hold their consoles together,they use L-brackets like you would find in low cost modular furniture. Very low quality craftsmanship,..if you can call it craftsmanship. Johannus is not any better,..lots of cost cutting going on it looks like! I'm sure they sound nice,..but console construction quality leaves a heck of a lot to be desired,unfortunately! Wish I could find a way to transfer the photos I was sent on Facebook over to this forum! Allen Organ builds their consoles to a much higher standard,and I would stick with them!

[smp]

I wholeheartedly agree - even the current models are much lower build quality than Allen. To be honest, I personally think that Allen is the only digital organ builder who build organs with the intention of making sure they last decades. They build them with the same quality that goes into pipe organs. No other digital builder comes anywhere near but then again I am very "OCD" and tend to make an opinion in the first 5 minutes of sitting at an organ.

[Piperdane]

The old Rodgers were the same way - those of 1970's analog vintage. Saw one open next to an Allen of the same year/vintage - there was no comparison in neatness of layout and wiring that Allen had then, and still does.

[toodles]

To be fair, Rodgers was using analog technology in the 1970s which inherently meant much more wiring. In the 1980's the Rodgers technology using a microprocessor to control the keying, the Rodgers console interiors became much more neat looking.

Through all the analog years, the Rodgers console construction was rugged and L-brackets were not used to hold the consoles together.

Did the construction photos come from the church-organs.com website, which is hosted by Allen Organ Company?

[Dewey643]

No,...I don't think so,..the person who sent them to me was an Allen organ dealer! Where he got them,I really don't know. I will say I have been on that site you're talking about,but I can't say for sure if they were taking from there or not! Regardless of where they came from,and who took them,it's just sad that Rodgers has went down the road of cheapening their console construction,whether now,or in years past. I did see similar photos on that site,though! I had a Rodgers dealer try to tell me they were "prototype" photos,..but later found out they were actual production models,..NOT "prototypes".

[jbird604]

While few folks would disagree that Allen has always built very sturdy consoles that tend to outlast even the electronics inside, it is probably unfair to label all the products from any company as inherently of inferior construction. It is possible that you saw some photos that were misleading. No doubt that some builders at times have had low-end models with poorly-made consoles. But I think today's top-tier builders all do a respectable job of building a console that will last for 30 or 40 years of normal usage as long as reasonable care is given them, and they are not subjected to stresses such as repeated moves.

I have seen certain panels in certain consoles from certain builders that were held in place with L-brackets, but I don't think the really essential joints in anybody's console are going to be done that way. At the very least the sides and front, the keydesk, the rear stretchers -- these cabinet parts would have to be glued together securely or else the console wouldn't even survive being delivered and set up.

So don't be deceived by pics that may have been carefully selected by a competitor to make somebody's products look shoddy. The builders and sellers of today's organs do need to be accountable for the quality and longevity of their products, but most buyers are going to spot really poor craftsmanship in a console if they will just take the time to look it over before they buy!

[Dewey643]

I have seen the insides of an Allen,..and yes,..things are far more neatly arranged,..and the fact they treat the interior surfaces of their consoles against harmful effects on wood. You can tell they are MUCH higher quality consoles. To be fair,..Rodgers does have a nice sound,..but their build quality keeps me from considering them.

[Casavant Fan]

No,...I don't think so,..the person who sent them to me was an Allen organ dealer!.

that says it all

[Dewey643]

that says it all

A Rodgers dealer would probably do the same given the opportunity! That's not to say I am knocking Rodgers,..I'm not. I have heard a Rodgers,and they do have a nice pipe like sound to them. Sound wise,..are they better than Allen? Well,..that is up to the listener to decide,..but seeing how they are constructed leave so much to be desired,..no matter who took those photos! I lean in favor of Allen when it comes to sound.

[Silken Path]

Wish I could find a way to transfer the photos I was sent on Facebook over to this forum! Allen Organ builds their consoles to a much higher standard,and I would stick with them!

Try right-clicking an image and select "Copy" and then paste it to your desktop. Some sites have javascript running to prevent dragging or copying images. You can sometimes circumvent this by right-click and "View Image" and THEN copy paste it.

[rjsilva]

...To be honest, I personally think that Allen is the only digital organ builder who build organs with the intention of making sure they last decades. ...No other digital builder comes anywhere near

I think some builders, such as Walker, Colby (consoles), M&O (do they make their own?), might disagree :)

[toodles]

I think Allen builds a very good console, though they have "cost reduced" their designs over time. That is the nature of business. Rodgers does not build as nice a console as they used to.

One of my complaints about Allen, and I have very few, is that they build all their own controls instead of buying from industry 3rd party manufacturers. Thus, their dual magnetic drawknob design isn't as good as you get from Syndyne. They say it ensures a continuing supply, but all the pipe organ builders use supply house parts for various parts of their consoles and organs and I am sure the suppliers will be around as long as Allen will be.

[myorgan]

To hold their consoles together,they use L-brackets like you would find in low cost modular furniture. Very low quality craftsmanship,..if you can call it craftsmanship.

You are so right!!! I've noticed how Allen uses just wingnuts and clips to hold the back to the organ on. What a chintzy setup!

I don't think anyone disputes Allen's build quality. My oldest organ (MOS-2 from 1983) is just as solid as the day it was built. The older Rodgers (analog) organs were also built like a truck. The 1974 organ at one church is also just as solid as the day it was built.

Unfortunately, people come and go at the various companies and standards change. Allen used to use solid wood...I wonder why they stopped?

Consider the source, and make sure it's a fair representation of another's product. Just my 2¢ worth.

Michael

[twnelson]

Most of M&O's consoles are custom built by Colby.

--- Tom

[voet]

It is amazing the sweeping conclusions someone is able to arrive at from a photo that they have seen, but, unfortunately, cannot share. What is even more incredible is the insight this person claims it provides into another brand.
I think most people would acknowledge the quality of Allen’s consoles, and there has been no disputing that in this thread. However, my opinion of Allen’s integrity went down considerably when they created the church-organs.com website. I was always taught, ”Don’t try to make yourself look good by putting others down.”