Johannus Organs

[Guest]

I recently got a chance to play the DVD touting the Johannus organ. It was in the AGO magazine.</p>

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Do any of you have positive or negative first hand experience with this "brand"?</p>

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Mortonman</p>

[soubasse32]

Re: Johannus Organs

I had to play one for several yearswhile we were waiting for a pipe organ to be installed.

[radagast]

Re: Johannus Organs



[quote user="soubasse32"]I had to play one for several yearswhile we were waiting for a pipe organ to be installed.[/quote]</P>


Soubasse32, I had to smile as I read your post. Maybe I am reading more into this than I should, but I pictured you not smiling as you wrote that. Of course I don't know what you look like, so I pictured a frowning Aristide.</P>


Bill</P>

[soubasse32]

Re: Johannus Organs



As Aristide would have said: "Bingo!". [:D]</P>


I'm slowly revealing myself to not be a fan of such instruments (though I own a digital organ myself)! I know lots of folks here like electronic organs, so Idon't wantto offend anyone.</P>


I had to perform on the Johannus many times. The good news is that I didn't find it any more objectionable than any other digital organ I've had to play recently, with the exception of the expression pedals (which were in a very odd order). I seem to recall that the Swell and Choir shoes were not adjacent, and there was no "all swells" function. [:(]</P>


The tone was rather neo-baroque (chiffy andstrangely "under-winded"); the baroque-style Vox Humana on the Great was a bit of an oddity.</P>


There may have been a fewmore issues, but I try not to remember. [:)]</P>


The best thing I can say about it is that I enjoyed playing around with Werckmeister and meantone temperaments.</P>

[Guest]

Re: Johannus Organs



I've had some experience with Johannus. Nothing to write home about in my opinion. If a digital organ is what is desired, I think one can do far better: Phoenix, Allen, or Rodgers. I must confess my bias though, I do prefer pipe. </P>


I did try a Wyvern some time ago, I believe those are made in the U.K. I am not sure if they are still around. That one was nice. </P>

[soubasse32]

Re: Johannus Organs



I'm quite familiar with Rodgers and Allen, and have to perform on one of these a couple times each year (I don't remember which one, or which model).</P>


I am not a heavy person by any stretch of the imagination, but I find that my fingers are just large enough to get stuck between the black keys! [:O] This is especially true if I am playing in one of the flat keys.</P>


The keyboard is also quite flimsy/mushy, which causes a lot of 'wrong notes'. [:(]</P>


Oh well, the keyboard on my pipe organ is also quite mushy - but at least my fingers fit!</P>

[dhm]

Re: Johannus Organs

[quote user="ReedGuy"]


I did try a Wyvern some time ago, I believe those are made in the U.K. I am not sure if they are still around. That one was nice. </P>


[/quote]</P>


They are definitely still around - I had a postcard a couple of weeks ago with their change of showroom address.</P>


They used to use Bradford System additive synthesis, but nowadays their budget range is made by Content in Holland (albeitwith English samples), and for their higher-end custom builds they use Phoenix technology (and charge a lot more than Phoenix do).</P>

[Guest]

Re: Johannus Organs



The experience I had with them was in the showroom here in the Tampa area. The sound was OK, but I was extremely dissappointed with the case work. The case itself (at least on this maodel I check out) was made of MDF (Medium Density Fiberboard). If you have never had any experience with MDF, the only thing I can say is, it is NOT for fine furniture like organ cases. If it ever gets wet, it buckles and tends to separate. That turned me off, especially after the sales rep tried to make me believe that MDF was better for organ cases than hardwood. Oh, really!! Since when?? [:O]</P>

[jbird604]

Re: Johannus Organs



IMHO, Johannus has improved a lot in the last few years.The models that were numbered 10, 20, and 30 (whether Opus or Sweelink), as well as the Rembrandt modelshad sturdy console components and the sound was much more pleasing, and more "American" (if that's fair to say . . . more like Allen, Rodgers, etc.) The key action, pistons, and stop tabs"feel" right and work in the conventional manner for the most part.</P>


Then, a year or so ago they revamped the whole line and the new models are certainly their best efforts yet. These models all end in "7" .. such as the Opus 27, 37, Sweelink 27, 37, Rembrandt 377, 497, etc. There are3 sample sets toswitch among, and you can quicklychoose oneby a piston press. And each sample set can be associated with any of4 different "finishing" schemes that you can set up using their Intonat software. Therefore,3 sample sets times4 finishings = 12 different sound schemes. A very flexible and useful feature that rivals what Allen and Rodgers do with QuadSuite and VoicePallette.</P>


Theyhave a new audioconfiguration that includes a low-pass channel with separate sub-woofers in most models now. And they have a number of refinements in tuning, articulation, etc., that may appeal to some listeners. And the samples are definitely far more American Classic now than ever before.</P>


So, don't write this company off too easily. Apparently they are selling a lot of organs, the company claims that they are second only to Allen now. And they have some good reps in the US who are doing some nice installations in the midwest (at least that's where I've seen them). My feeling is that they've become a viable alternative. The caseworkmay not be as detailedas American brands, butyou sure get a lot of stuff for your money -- lots of audio channels, lots of stops, lots of capture action, etc. I know of one church that recently got a quote in the mid-$40's on anice 3-manual, specs similar to an Allen or Rodgers that would cost at least twice the money.</P>


John</P>

[arie v]

Re: Johannus Organs



Roy,</p>

In the swamps of Florida you may find all solid wood preferable, but in a lot of places where humidity can vary from nigh near 100% to below 10%, solid wood tends to split, warp, bend etc. I remember having to work on consoles made in England, and most part were solid wood. Very high degree of workmanship, but troubles started almost immediately. On one console, after 3 weeks, I couldn't even get the back on. Had to be shaved down. When I service it now, I have to pry the back off with a screwdriver. Even the consoles made locally, over time, it was the solid wood parts on the stop rail that gave the most problems. The stop rail over time would crack. The rest of the console, with the exception of the pedalboard, was made of particle board with thick veneers and even after 25 years, some look and feel as good as new.</p>

The reality is, at least where I live, making consoles out of solid wood, means investing in a climate controlled environment, hand picking logs, aging (drying) wood for 5 to 7 years, and then when working on it, making sure the wood is very well sealed. Most of what comes from lumber yards, is just not very stable or good.</p>

AV</p>



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[mak1457]

Re: Johannus Organs

Sorry for bringing up a old topic, but having just played my first Johannus yesterday I am definitely putting my stock with them. Not that I've abandoned Rodgers by any means but I was too impressed with the organ. True it's only an Opus 7 but for me, it's the quality of sound that counts, not all the bells and whistles. This organ is just the thing my struggling church needs.

[jbird604]

Re: Johannus Organs



MAK,</P>


That little Opus 7 is definitely a decent little starter organ. If you can manage to get it and replace that aging Conn, you'll definitely enjoy it. As you said in another thread, you may not want to sink any money into that old Conn if there's a chance of getting this new one.</P>


The price you mentioned is a bargain, best I can tell. I think it was meant to sell for more like $7500, so $6K is a good discount.</P>


It is truly a "starter" model, though, and the church will outgrow it (let us hope) long before it wears out. It can be expanded with an external audio system, so you might get by with it in a larger worship space, but not forever. There are too few ranks and stops to fill a large church, unless you over-amplify it, which will make it "loud" enough, but lacking in authenticity because an individual stop will be much louder than a corresponding pipe rank. It does have a volume knob, though, so you can back that off when you truly need soft stops.</P>


You will also begin to want more features -- crescendo, divided expression, larger stop list, bigger combination action, etc. The minimalist 3-channel audio will also limit the clarity of the stops, and you will eventually want better sound. The pedalboard is not fully AGO and might cramp your style one of these days, though it's much better than the 25 pedals on your present Conn.</P>


But all that is in the future, and this little organ will be a tremendous upgrade over that old Conn. Go for it!</P>


John</P>
<P mce_keep="true"></P>

[mak1457]

Re: Johannus Organs



Thanks for the encouragement John. I definitely want to make this a go - however it will probably involve about a years worth of fundraising. Twenty members can't raise even that kind of money too quickly. I also have an uphill battle of convincing the deacon board. But I've decided I'm going to work towards it even if it involves some pain and sacrificing.</P>


I should also say I'm used to more features as it is (I played a Rodgers T787 for 5 years) but at this point all I want is better sound and more options than what I have right now.</P>

[soubasse32]

Re: Johannus Organs



I just did a concert with a Johannus - in fact, the very same one I used to play when awaiting a new pipe organ. (It had been relocated to another church which finds itself temporarily without a pipe organ).</P>


I wasapprehensive to learnthat the fine pipe organ at that venue was out of commission for my concert, and resigned myself to refamiliarizing myself with the Johannus.</P>


The same issues awaited me: flabby keys, a certain pedal note that only worked when I stomped upon it, no 'all swells' and an odd arrangement of expression pedals. The expression pedals on any electronic seem to modulate the tone so linearly (for lack of a better term) that it sounds almost exactly like turning down the volume on a stereo - very unrealistic.</P>


This was not helped by the fact that there is very little resistance on the Johannus expression pedals.</P>


I had forgotten one little annoyance - when the swell shoe reached a full-closed position the volume fluctuated several times. The volume actually increased and decreased two or three times as I was striving for the ultimate pianissimo. [:@]</P>


I find it extremely odd that you have to press a lighted piston in order to turn the crescendo pedal on. [:S] Too bad that the crescendo pedal is not programmable (as far as I know). I'd rather not have the baroque-sounding Vox Humana (on the Great!) come on so early (actually I'd leave it off the crescendo pedal altogether)! The 32' reed finds itself at the very end of the crescendo pedal, but oddly it is not on the Tutti. [*-)]</P>


I noticed that the light bulb illuminating the Pedal 16' Lieblich Gedeckt had nearly burned itself out, and the surface of the drawknob seemed almost distorted from the heat of the internal bulb.</P>


There was a decidedelectronic soundto most of thepedal stops - almost like a sine wave.</P>


Every reed stop sounded bizarre. The only stops on the whole organ that were pleasant were the celestes and 32' Bourdon.</P>


Overall, the tonal palette was skewed towards neo-baroque (overabundance of chiff and an odd sort of under-winded quality). I believe thismodel was builtin the1990's (thoughI don't know the exact model number).</P>


I visited the Johannus website to determine which model I had played and was annoyed to find absolutely NO documentation about previous models. If I had shelled out $$$ for an electronic, I would expect to find online documentation and support for every model. Do they expectthe ownersto buy a new one every few years? [:|]</P>


Fortunately, the church had a huge amount of reverberation - perhaps the average person in the audience did not know the difference.</P>


But for me, it was not a pleasant experience.</P>


PS: In fairness to Johannus, I'm pretty critical of all electronic organs. [^o)]</P>

[arie v]

Re: Johannus Organs



Soubasse,</p>

If this brand "J" organ was from the 1990s, what you say makes sense. However, things have changed a lot. Not that I am the world's greatest fan of these organs, they have addressed a lot of your concerns. The expression now is more like a true swell as opposed to just a volume control they had until maybe 3 or 4 years ago. The stops are better, and at least for North American customers, they sound more North American. I still don't find a lot of their samples very realistic, nor their ensemble. Their audio systems are of the cheap variety, and they sound kind of that way too.</p>

I know it is a common practice to, condemn a product or a company based on stuff they put out say 10 or 15 years. Sometimes companies actually strive and succeed in putting out product that is much better. I think it can be safely said, that all the major European manufacturers now build instruments that are far better in build quality and musical ability than say what they were putting out in the early 90s. And doing so, at a cost that is significantly less than either Rodgers or Allen. That is why they are succeeding in a declining marketplace.</p>

Not that very many of these instruments even hold a candle to a decent pipe organ...........but that is another discussion.</p>

AV</p>