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What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?

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  • What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?



    My old H183 has the reverb settings but doesn't give me the desired "sustain" effect that my Roland Atelier gives me.</p>

    Did Hammond ever put a "sustain" effect on any of their organs ? Or do they consider their reverb effect the same as a sustain ?
    </p>

    Has anyone rigged up an external sustain effect generator for their Hammond ?</p>


    </p>

  • #2
    Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?

    My 8222 Aurora had a funky sustain setting if I remember correctly... The rest of the organ isnt desirable though. Your best bet is some kind of sustainer pedal.

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    • #3
      Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?



      I've a cheesy Hammond-Nihon 8000 (aka Cougar) it also has sustain, but likewise the organ isn't worth a tinker's cuss!</P>


      -Brendon</P>
      -1958 Hofner 550 archtop guitar -1959 C3 and PR40- -1964 Busillachio Harmonium- -1964 M101-
      -1967ish Leslie 122- -1975 T500 (modded..chopped, and reassembled!)-
      -DIY 760 FrankenLeslie/rat hideout-
      -1980 Electrokey Electric Piano- -Yamaha electric Harmonium (early 80's?)-
      -1990 Jansen GMF150 amp- -1992 Korg 01W/fd- -1992 G&L S-500 geetar.

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      • #4
        Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?

        [quote user="Rogers"]

        My old H183 has the reverb settings but doesn't give me the desired "sustain" effect that my Roland Atelier gives me.</p>

        Did Hammond ever put a "sustain" effect on any of their organs ? Or do they consider their reverb effect the same as a sustain ?
        </p>

        Has anyone rigged up an external sustain effect generator for their Hammond ?</p>


        </p>

        [/quote]</p>

        Doesn't your H already does have a sustain voice - Harp Sustain?</p>

        That's the only sustain voice that Hammond even put on a tonewheel organ, and even then it only went on certain E's, H's and the R series. Lack of proper sustain is one of the reasons Hammond lost a lot of ground in the home organ market. Reverb and sustain are two very different things (though interestingly a very few makers like Conn used a short sustain in place of Tibia reverb! Reverb is a natural acoustic effect and the reverb system in an organ mimics this. Sustain (as found in an organ) is an entirely electronic effect allowing you to recreate things like bells, hawaiian guitars etc on older instruments and, on more modern instruments, to give sustain to piano, percussions, guitars, strings and so on. So, no, reverb and sustain weren't considered as being the same (with those few exceptions I mentioned).
        </p>

        Coming back to Hammond, it wasn't until the LSI organs appeared - Concorde, Aurora etc - that you had sustain. Even then it was just on/off and rather a short sustain. Still nothing like Lowrey or Conn, for example.</p>

        The answer to your final question is almost certainly 'No'.</p>

        Andy</p>
        It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

        New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

        Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha Genos, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
        Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
        Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
        Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

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        • #5
          Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?



          On the Concorde, it was Sustain Upper Short, Sustain Upper Long, Sustain Lower, and Pedal Sustain 1, and Pedal Sustain 2. On the next series (Elegante, Collanade, Commodore), I believe they finally went to sliders for the sustain.</P>


          Mark</P>

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          • #6
            Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?

            B-3000 has sustain. I don't use it. I only want my notes playing when I am pressing the keys.

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            • #7
              Re: What's the difference between Sustain and Reverb ?

              The M3 has a pedal sustain. I believe the sustain problem (electronically) is how do you deal with sustaining mechanical tone generation using a combination setting of 9 drawbars, you would have to add sustain circuits to each tonewheel signal (could be 90+), which would likely have added greater complexity, additional circuits and hardware and cost. M3 pedals uses complex tonewheels (no drawbar combinations) which makes it easier to sustain a signal from a single source. Solid state made sustain easier to achieve, especially LSI (yr roland) and likely some or all the all electronic hammonds. Model H used transistors and tubes and had a 'harp sustain' which I am not familiar with. Reverb was likely their best shot at getting a sustain, but I believe the intent of reverb using springs (which I believe Hammond invented) was to create a depth of sound to make a small sound dead furniture filled living room echo like a big hall or cathedral.

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