leslie 147 pop

[waterman]

I am looking at purchasing a solid state relay for my 147 but before I do, I would like to get opinions about where to buy it and which is best / cost effective. I also want one that can be user installed.</P>


The popping is very annoying and loud. I read that having the cable coiled up can cause the pop but even after I rearranged the cable it still pops about the same. I have noticed that sometimes I get little or no pop depending on how fast I flip the switch.Is there any work around other than the ss relay? </P>


I've read a lot of the posts concerning the 147 pop but I couldn't find any specific answers about the ss relay.</P>


thanks</P>

[andyg]

Re: leslie 147 pop

IIRC, there's a capacitor across the existing relay. Have you replaced it? My 145's and 147 were all pop-free, so they can be silent.

[geoelectro]

Re: leslie 147 pop



Actually three caps. One across each relay contact found on the motor plugs. And one across the relay coil found at the 6-pin plug.</p>

.1 @ 600Vac.</p>

Geoelectrro
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[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop

Thanks Andy and Geo. I haven't replaced the caps so I guess I should do that first. I've never done that before but I want to learn to maintain my instruments myself so I am willing to learn. Gotta start somewhere. Is this a bad place to start? Do you know of any instructional videos or pics that document this process or at least show which caps to replace? I'm decent at soldering so I'm sure I can change them if I know for sure which ones to change. I'm not schematic literate so they aren't much help.

[Brendon Wright]

Re: leslie 147 pop

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Aha!</P>


Time to visit the good captain's site for the 147 service manual!</P>


either this one...</P>


http://www.captain-foldback.com/Lesl...ers_manual.zip</P>


or this one:</P>


http://www.captain-foldback.com/Lesl...ers_manual.zip</P>


while both have schematics, neither have the amps in pictorial fashion.</P>


I don't have one of these babies, but expect to find the relay underneath the metal chassis of the amp.... does anyone have photos under there where we could see the relay and where the caps are?</P>
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[Brendon Wright]

Re: leslie 147 pop



I'm afraid this is the best I can do:</P>


</P>


You see two caps circled in red,I missed the one going between pin 2 and 5 of the plug.</P>


Leslie plugs are notorious at blowing up amps (I've done it myself a few times, but learned how to repair as a result!) because the power on pins 3 and 4 can sometimes touch against the socket sending mains power through the audio line!!</P>


Either NEVER insert/remove the plug when the power is on, or disconnect pins 3 and 4 from both the organ and leslie end and instead put in a power cord with a switch, preferably the computer type of "jug cord" with a socket. If you trip over it it pulls out rather than shorting!</P>


While I haven't got photos to help, I guess you can identify pin 4 from the socket and trace the line until you've found all the o.1uF caps.</P>


To replace them, buy the caps that arerectangular shaped polyester jobs, "X2" rated for mains power.</P>


Distortion in the bass.....</P>


Could it be.... the cap in the crossover, even? Somebody here said replace all the electrolytic caps. I guess that's bound to cover it!</P>


Cheers!</P>


-Brendoon</P>
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[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop

Thanks Brendon, I think I can locate the caps using your drawing. I already knew about making sure the power is off before plugging or unplugging the cable. The idea of installing a separate power cord really sounds like a good idea. I know the newer leslies have a separate power cord. For some reason I thought the 117v had to come from the organ. Thanks for the links, I'll check them out.

[johnny b3]

Re: leslie 147 pop



I hope i'm not on to confuse, but the 117V does come from the organ. i've never had an instance of messing up the 6-pin plug and shorting the AC to audio lines...I just can't see how it could be done unless the female plug contacts break off...never seen this happen. </p>

Most likely you'll find sprague orange drop caps in your amp which look like this, but with different values of course (.1@600V):</p>

</p>

</p>

A schematic is great for re-assurance but you really don't need it. You'll see the back of the motor AC sockets clear as day, and the 2 caps to do with them. The same goes for the cap for the relay - it should be wired up right at the 6-pin plug, between pins 2/5. See below...the only 3 orange caps around.
</p>

</p>

</p>

Depending on the age of the amp you may not have orange drops...they might be black. Either way these pics should help you out. </p>

[Brendon Wright]

Re: leslie 147 pop



Ah!Brilliant!</p>

Thanks Johnny!</p>

It took a wee while to see the red circles, but that's perfect.</p>

I have to admit my misadventure wasn't a six pin plug, it was a transplanted 5 pin plug from an old internal leslie. I have my treble in a separate head unit and made use of the 5 pin plug to carry power and sound from the main unit. It's also pretty unlikely to get the asymmetrical plug into the wrong holes.</p>

I didn't even plug her in... but I DID have the power on!!</p>

The plug touched somewhere on the socket and sparked, then she was all over. I don't exactly know what touched what, but I thought the contacts in the socket must have been a shade close to the outside if that could happen. </p>

My 9 pin plug however is wearing out: the keyhole shaped prong in the middle is all rounded, this is a recipe for disaster.</p>

The interesting thing is I thought all of these "safety measures" were for wimpy guys, then I realised it's to protect the AMP not the player!! </p>

However, if the plugs are in tidy condition and you're not an absentminded professor, I wouldn't get paranoid about it. I dunno if I'd actually want to drill a hole in a 147, truth be told......</p>

-Brendoon</p>

</p>

[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop



Awesome Johnny. Thanks for the pics. That helps a lot. </P>

[Guest]

Re: leslie 147 pop



Hi folks...1st post.</P>


I agree that all of these 'fixes' are less expensive than replacing with a solid state relay, but I think you have to judge your fix based on your playing style. </P>


I use tremelo for phrase expression; much like a singer uses vibrato on the voice. I like to creep it in at the end of certain phrases so for me, it's on and off a lot. When it was timefor me to 'fix'my problem, I also thought about the relay and the constant'clack'it was producing asI switched on and off. </P>


Iwent with the solid state YEARS ago when Bob S. first marketed one and I've never been happier. It was one of the best improvements to my 145 I ever made. Besides removing the pop and clack, italso had the capability for 'Stop' but I never did both to use that feature. </P>

[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop



Thanks for the insight Deut.</P>


I understand and I am considering the ss relay. I'veread a lot of good reviews about thembut myquestion is this:</P>


If the caps need replacing, shouldn't they be replaced anyhowor will the caps be removed during the installation of the solid state relay? </P>


Pardon, my inexperience. I am a beginner when it comes to electronics.</P>

[Guest]

Re: leslie 147 pop

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With fair credit given to all of the other knowledgeable and excellent responses, yes. Adding a SS relay will <U>NOT</U> fix a bad component, and yes, I did perform a Cap change while it was on the bench.</P>


Always a wise decision given the 30+ year-old circuit that it was at that time. Now, at almost 50 years,it can still rip and stillhas the original motors and drivers.</P>


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[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop



ah so the caps should be replaced regardless of whether I go with the s/s relay</P>


ok, thanks to everyone. I really appreaciate the information and input. </P>

[waterman]

Re: leslie 147 pop: UPDATE



I had plugged a keyboard into the rca input on the swell housing so I could run it through the leslie. Bad idea. That was the source of the loud popping noise every time I switched the leslie from slow to fast. I unplugged it and the pop is much much less noticable and most of the time it is quiet. I'm not sure what caused the pop but it had something to do with that keyboard running into the hammond amp via that rca input. Just thought I'd pass that along for the next person who is experiencing that annoying pop when they switch their leslie to fast.</P>