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  • C3 Manual Chassis Cover gooey foam issue

    Hi again,

    My C3 is serial number 91748. Judging by the serial it was probably manufactured 1963/64. I wish I knew if the seal behind the Manual Chassis Cover is still felt or has the dreaded gooey foam strip installed. Is there a way to find out without dismantling the Manual Chassis?

    Thanks,
    Skippy
    AS FAR AS ORGANS ARE CONCERNED - I'M A GOOD MECHANIC AND A HOPELESS DRIVER.
    Hammond C3 & M102 & Elegante & PR40. Yamaha D85 & D65 & FS30 & MC600 & GX76. Thomas Celebrity Royale 871, Kawai T5 & E550, Conn 643 & 632 & 552.Lowrey H25R2. Elka EP12. Orla D6180, Wurlitzer 4430 & Omni 7000 & 555. Roland D70 & RA90 . Ferrofish B4000+. Leslie 145 & 705 & 710 & 720

  • #2
    Yes, there is a way to find out whether you have foam just by inspection. Look in the back of the organ and locate the surface of the manual covers. Then look for either a series of brass rivets, or a series of holes. Hammond used rivets to affix the felt, so if you've got rivets, you've got felt. If holes only, then you're looking at the dreaded foam.

    Note that it's entirely possible to have one of each, especially in your date range. My early '64 A101 has foam on top, felt on the bottom... just how they happened to grab them off the pile on the assembly line!

    good luck-
    td
    Nobody loves me but my mother,
    And she could be jivin' too...

    --BB King

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks td,
      Excellent info.
      Skippy
      AS FAR AS ORGANS ARE CONCERNED - I'M A GOOD MECHANIC AND A HOPELESS DRIVER.
      Hammond C3 & M102 & Elegante & PR40. Yamaha D85 & D65 & FS30 & MC600 & GX76. Thomas Celebrity Royale 871, Kawai T5 & E550, Conn 643 & 632 & 552.Lowrey H25R2. Elka EP12. Orla D6180, Wurlitzer 4430 & Omni 7000 & 555. Roland D70 & RA90 . Ferrofish B4000+. Leslie 145 & 705 & 710 & 720

      Comment


      • #4
        Also possible to have no holes or rivets at all; indicating foam.
        Interesting TD, never knew you could have one of each.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks johnny b3
          AS FAR AS ORGANS ARE CONCERNED - I'M A GOOD MECHANIC AND A HOPELESS DRIVER.
          Hammond C3 & M102 & Elegante & PR40. Yamaha D85 & D65 & FS30 & MC600 & GX76. Thomas Celebrity Royale 871, Kawai T5 & E550, Conn 643 & 632 & 552.Lowrey H25R2. Elka EP12. Orla D6180, Wurlitzer 4430 & Omni 7000 & 555. Roland D70 & RA90 . Ferrofish B4000+. Leslie 145 & 705 & 710 & 720

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by johnny b3 View Post
            Also possible to have no holes or rivets at all; indicating foam.
            Yes thanks JB3, I forgot about that possibility as it's the one I haven't personally come across.

            Skippy, what did you find in yours?

            cheers,
            td
            Nobody loves me but my mother,
            And she could be jivin' too...

            --BB King

            Comment


            • #7
              BAD NEWS! Looks like it has the dreaded foam. This is what I said in my first post: My C3 is serial number 91748. Judging by the serial it was probably manufactured 1963/64.
              I found a hand written date below the preset instruction label showing 13 August 1968 AM. This puts it well into the foam era. So much for the accuracy of the serial list/age cross reference.
              When I did the foldback on my M102 I found the lower and upper fitted with the foam. Some lower contact wires had been exposed to the mess and broke as soon as I moved them. But I had no missing notes. Makes me wonder how they still conducted.
              Never mind, I'm not about to panic and pull the manual assemblies apart. I start worrying when I get missing notes.

              Thanks for your interest and help,
              Skippy
              AS FAR AS ORGANS ARE CONCERNED - I'M A GOOD MECHANIC AND A HOPELESS DRIVER.
              Hammond C3 & M102 & Elegante & PR40. Yamaha D85 & D65 & FS30 & MC600 & GX76. Thomas Celebrity Royale 871, Kawai T5 & E550, Conn 643 & 632 & 552.Lowrey H25R2. Elka EP12. Orla D6180, Wurlitzer 4430 & Omni 7000 & 555. Roland D70 & RA90 . Ferrofish B4000+. Leslie 145 & 705 & 710 & 720

              Comment


              • #8
                From what i can see in your pics you have rivits on both manuals which would indicate felts and no foam.
                1955 Hammond C3, 1965 Leslie 145, Trek ll Reverb, PROFKON ZD1 Overdrive Unit, Hamptone LEQ3B

                Comment


                • #9
                  I would not place any anxiety on a hand written date inside Hammond Organs of this era. It could be an oiling notation, a service inspection, someone changing the presets, but even when selling them new, I have seen no reliable factory notations inside these. I seem to recall that employees were not allowed to make notations of these kinds. Rivets, or lack of them, serial numbers, black or silver transformer, and other clues, lend support to this being an earlier '60s model. And these facts together could be misconstrued if the instrument was modified in any way.
                  Larry K

                  Hammond BV+22H+DR-20, Celviano for piano practice
                  Retired: Hammond L-102, M-3, S-6, H-112, B-2+21H+PR-40, B-3+21H, Hammond Aurora Custom, Colonnade.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Last time I went to talk to my local tech, he was just pulling apart an A-100 with foam. He ended up switching out the entire manual assembly, because of several other problems. But he told me if it's not falling apart and/or causing problems, don't worry about it.

                    Another (more pain-in-the-ass) way to tell, is if you pull the manuals out. When I cleaned the busbars on mine, I could see the foam under the cover, but it wasn't falling apart. Actually seemed rather non-gooey... unlike the foam under the top of my A-100.
                    Keyboards: 1972 Fender Rhodes Stage 73, M-111, M-3, A-100, M2 Desk(!), B3!
                    Spinny things: Wurlitzer Tone Cabs (500 and 420), PR-40, 31W, 31H, chopped 31H, 125 (empty cabinet), 30A!!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Ya Skippy, looks like you have rivets along each manual so you're okay.

                      Also, "Dreaded Foam" is a really phobic phrase that gets thrown around a lot - it's unnecessary to spread panic about foam unless the organ has spent years in a hot humid climate and/or is gigged with/thrown around a lot.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by handyczech View Post
                        I would not place any anxiety on a hand written date inside Hammond Organs of this era. It could be a {...} notation {by} someone changing the presets.
                        Yes, this was my thought also. And they did look like the brass rivets to me too, although it's been awhile since I did this kind of inspection. You may be OK after all... and as has also been pointed out, the foam isn't automatically a problem even if it's there. Again, my A101 has foam on the upper manual, but no troubles whatsoever with missing tones.
                        Nobody loves me but my mother,
                        And she could be jivin' too...

                        --BB King

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          My Ex Ice Rink C3 has it's original inspection label attached, it's dated March 1964.

                          I picked up an M102 yesterday it has gooey foam
                          1962 L100
                          1964 White C3
                          1966 M102
                          PR40 x 2
                          Leslie 145 Converted to Balanced input, 12v mains and speed switching and IEC mains input.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            This thread has got me looking at my A-102. Serial #21369. I see no rivets or holes. I have no missing notes. I live in a hot humid environment (at least during the summer): Kansas City. However I believe the organ has been inside an air conditioned home it's entire life.
                            Hammond A-102
                            Hammond M3 - project
                            Hammond PR-40 tone cabinet
                            Leslie 145
                            One Leslie 60 and one 70 for use with Rhodes and Wurlitzer piano

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Great news,

                              My M102 has got the foam but it hasn't leaked on to the wiring, I managed to get the covers off without
                              completely removing the manuals from the cabinet, so all I have to do is get some felt tomorrow and
                              glue it on and re-assemble the organ.
                              1962 L100
                              1964 White C3
                              1966 M102
                              PR40 x 2
                              Leslie 145 Converted to Balanced input, 12v mains and speed switching and IEC mains input.

                              Comment

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