Repairing peeling paint

[mpnmatthews]

Hey good friends,

Any tips on how to repair peeling damage of the paint on the metal around the manuals?

Thanks much!

[skydawg]

If you`re referring to the rails in front of the keys,might as well remove,strip and repaint.The decal is available.

[Bobmann]

Agree. Patching is an exercise in futility.

The original looks like it was powder coated, I have tried paint stripper but had no effect.
I use a pad sander to strip to bare metal, prime, paint with a black then clear coat.

I got the decal from Pierce Piano Atlas
http://www.piercepianoatlas.com/

Bob

[BoaterCanuck]

I have been painting stuff for years. Strip, prime, paint sand sand sand polish. Never again. I am in the process of restoring a Northern Hammond BC from around 1938. Took the front rails out, sanded them smooth and wrapped them with matte black vinyl wrap. Looks perfect and I mean perfect.

https://www.amazon.ca/VViViD-DECO65-...ds=vivid+vinyl

[mpnmatthews]

Very interesting! Do you have any pics of the finished rails?

[BoaterCanuck]

In the middle of varathane so I have both manuals covered in plastic to keep the dust off the inside. When I uncover them I will post some pics. They truly look perfect and for the price of the wrap, not much to lose. The first one that I did I cut the vinyl off at each edge. Looks okay but the second rail, I wrapped it around the back about 1/2 inch. I may never spray paint anything again.

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Very interesting! Do you have any pics of the finished rails?

In the middle of varathane so I have both manuals covered in plastic to keep the dust off the inside. When I uncover them I will post some pics. They truly look perfect and for the price of the wrap, not much to lose. The first one that I did I cut the vinyl off at each edge. Looks okay but the second rail, I wrapped it around the back about 1/2 inch. I may never spray paint anything again.

[Bobmann]

I have been painting stuff for years. Strip, prime, paint sand sand sand polish. Never again. I am in the process of restoring a Northern Hammond BC from around 1938. Took the front rails out, sanded them smooth and wrapped them with matte black vinyl wrap. Looks perfect and I mean perfect.

https://www.amazon.ca/VViViD-DECO65-...ds=vivid+vinyl

Interesting. I see that it also comes in glossy that would better match original finsh.

Also see that it does not ship to US. I imagine that there is some equivalent down here, I will have to search.

I would have to see what it looks like after a while, though. I would think that paint would be a lot more durable than vinyl, and the top part of that rail does see some abuse, especially on the lower manual. I would hate to send out an organ with this on the rail just to have a customer complain that it got torn and I have to fix it...not to mention the cost of another Hammond decal.

Please let us know how this works out. If I can find something similar down here, I will get some to experiment with.

Bob

[JoeyB3]

Also see that it does not ship to US. I imagine that there is some equivalent down here, I will have to search.

Bob

Bob...
https://www.ebay.com/i/182749190466?chn=ps

[muckelroy]

Says product lifetime is 5 years. I imagine it would stick around much longer than that, but who knows how it will look after 10, 20 years?

[Bobmann]

Bob...
https://www.ebay.com/i/182749190466?chn=ps

Thanks for the information.
I went ahead and purchased a roll of the stuff in glossy black.
When I get it and have a chance to use it I will let you all know what I think.

Bob

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Says product lifetime is 5 years. I imagine it would stick around much longer than that, but who knows how it will look after 10, 20 years?

I went on to the web site, and this is used primarily for automotive applications...they wrap cars in the stuff.
I would think that a car would see much harsher treatment than a Hammond, so the life may be longer.

Jury is out until i get some and try it out.

Bob

[BoaterCanuck]

This is vivid matte black vinyl. Flat surface too so it will take a decal.

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Says product lifetime is 5 years. I imagine it would stick around much longer than that, but who knows how it will look after 10, 20 years?

I considered that when I made the choice. From what I've read, that is in terms of using it on a car and is more in reference to "you have to get it off the car in 5 years or it won't come off". It's 100 vinyl so I'm counting on it lasting like normal vinyl. Worst case, I can redo it in 5 years and not even have to remove the rails.

[mpnmatthews]

This is awesome. That black is so deep and rich, you could lose yourself in it.

This seems like a good solution for the rails...

But it seems to me that something with an adhesive back wouldn’t be suitable if you have to cover ALL the exposed metal. My particular problem spot on my C2 is around the vibrato switch openings above and to the left of the upper manual.



It seems to me that the adhesive might interfere with the operation of the rocker switches if you cut the holes precisely; or if you could figure out a way to wrap the metal frame around the rocker switches, the extra thickness of the metal wrapped in vinyl will also cause a problem.

Maybe you have some insight?

[BoaterCanuck]

This is awesome. That black is so deep and rich, you could lose yourself in it.

This seems like a good solution for the rails...

But it seems to me that something with an adhesive back wouldn’t be suitable if you have to cover ALL the exposed metal. My particular problem spot on my C2 is around the vibrato switch openings above and to the left of the upper manual.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]29755[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]29756[/ATTACH]

It seems to me that the adhesive might interfere with the operation of the rocker switches if you cut the holes precisely; or if you could figure out a way to wrap the metal frame around the rocker switches, the extra thickness of the metal wrapped in vinyl will also cause a problem.

Maybe you have some insight?

If you have good adhesion, you should be able to adhere the vinyl wrap right up to the cutout for the switch and trim it off flush with the cutout and not wrap it underneath. They use this stuff to wrap bumpers, rims, mirrors, door handles and even brake calipers as well as the entire car. The wrap is very tacky once it is cured. When used on a car, a couple of days in the sunlight is enough to cure it. A smooth surface is critical as any imperfections will telegraph through the wrap.

I sanded all the chips smooth and then roughed up the entire surface with 220 grit sandpaper. Same as if you were prepping for painting. Wiped it down with denatured alcohol.

Watch some youtube videos and see what they are doing with this stuff on cars. Even if you try in and wreck your first attempt, just remove it and start over with a new piece.

BTW, I just realized that I did in fact wrap the other piece of metal under the draw bars. Mine is a BC so I don't have the 3 rocker switches like yours but there is a cutout for the chorus control. It was not my original intent to wrap that part of it but the rails looked so much better than the 3rd piece I decided to wrap it as well.

[BoaterCanuck]

Thanks for the information.
I went ahead and purchased a roll of the stuff in glossy black.
When I get it and have a chance to use it I will let you all know what I think.

Bob

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I went on to the web site, and this is used primarily for automotive applications...they wrap cars in the stuff.
I would think that a car would see much harsher treatment than a Hammond, so the life may be longer.

Jury is out until i get some and try it out.

Bob

Yeah, I agree. A Hammond in a living room vs a car. Vinyl is vinyl so I am counting on it lasting as long as any other vinyl. It looks awesome and is so much easier than painting and sanding and polishing. Way more durable as well. The only restrictions that I have heard is that it should come off the car in no more than 5 years, if not, it will pull up the paint when it is finally removed.

[Bobmann]

Update on the vinyl wrap.

I got a roll of the gloss black to try to put on the front rail.
It was indeed very easy to install, not necessarily less work than painting, though.
On the plus side, witht the vinyl there are no fumes or overspray to put up with.

The rail really needs to be sanded down to bare metal, as even paint that you think is blended will show through.
The rail that I did had a little rust on the top. I thought that I had it sanded down where it would not show, but I can see the pitted surface thru the vinyl.
I use a pad sander with 150 grit paper to get the paint off, then pad sander and 220 grit, then 320 grit wet/dry paper and use Mineral Spirits as a lubricant.
Takes less than 20 minutes.

I was a little disappointed in the gloss finish; it looks like a painted surface that has a little orange peel.
I guess I was expecting a glassy smooth surface.
This is a reflection of my desk lamp on the bottom front rail that I put the vinyl on. I can get a smoother finish with paint/clear coat even without a post rub down.
Keep in mind that I may be more critical than most people, so temper the results with what is acceptable for your purpose.

The other thing that I noticed was that the surface scratches pretty easily. Just the action of my finger rubbing the film on left micro-scratches. The result is really not that noticeable at arm's length, it looks like swirl marks that you see on the hood of your car when the light shines on it at the right angle. You have to look close with the light just right.
Really, this may not be that visible when the rail is installed, as the light is seldom at that angle when it is on the keyboard.

So, the question is whether I would use this on the front rails...personally, I will stick to painting them.
Bottom line is that the parts need to be prepared the same, that is sanded smooth either way.
After getting the surface smooth, either apply the vinyl or spray paint. There is no clear time advantage either way.

For the $10 that a roll cost, it was worth a try. I suggest that anyone else do the same...this may be perfectly acceptable to everyone else.
Worst case is that it can be peeled off if the results are not what you want.

As far as applying to the metal part under the drawbars, if I were to do it I would certainly wrap the vinyl around the edges of the holes for the tablet switches. Heat the vinyl and stretch it around the edge and it is pretty thin. I do not think it is thick enough to interfere with the switch action. My concern that if the vinyl were cut at the edge of the hole, it would eventually peel up with use.
I wrapped the vinyl around the top edge of the tail and underneath where the felt strip is attached...it was pretty easy to do.

I will probably use this stuff in other places that I have not thought of yet. On their web site they have a video of an application on kitchen cabinets.

Bob