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  • Desirability (and Value) of Specific Models

    Hello all,

    I get where the B-3 is the king of the hill when it comes to Hammonds, and as far as desirability and worth, I would imagine the next four in line (in no particular order) are the C-3; RT-3; and the A-100 and D-100 series. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.)

    So my question is this: What follows in the pecking order? Any sleepers out there? Also, I've always been curious as to why the B-3 has it's esteemed status over the models listed above, which are all essentially the same thing as the B-3, at least from the insides. Is it because the B-3 is easier to transport and hence, all the organ idols of yesteryear went with that model when traveling and recording, or some aesthetic reason? Or perhaps it's something else... Thanks! I look forward to hearing all your thoughts.
    sigpic
    1956 Hammond C-3
    Circa 1965 Leslie 145
    1963 Hammond D-152
    1963 Hammond C-3
    1959 Hammond HR-40 Tone Cabinet
    Motion Sound Pro 3
    Motion Sound Low Pro
    1958 Hammond M-3
    C.Bechstein D282 9'3" Concert Grand
    1977 Wurlitzer 200A

  • #2
    I wonder if it wasn't aesthetics and the rule of primacy. Ethel Smith put the Hammond into the public eye with movies, and the ear with recordings. She could really tear up the keys and pedals while looking great doing it. The open style cabinet allowed the viewer to best see everything that was happening. Whatever thing brings someone success influences the others that follow.
    Tom in Tulsa

    Fooling with: 1969 E100, 1955 M3, 1963 M100, Leslie 720

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by tpappano View Post
      I wonder if it wasn't aesthetics and the rule of primacy. Ethel Smith put the Hammond into the public eye with movies, and the ear with recordings. She could really tear up the keys and pedals while looking great doing it. The open style cabinet allowed the viewer to best see everything that was happening. Whatever thing brings someone success influences the others that follow.
      I think those are very valid points.
      sigpic
      1956 Hammond C-3
      Circa 1965 Leslie 145
      1963 Hammond D-152
      1963 Hammond C-3
      1959 Hammond HR-40 Tone Cabinet
      Motion Sound Pro 3
      Motion Sound Low Pro
      1958 Hammond M-3
      C.Bechstein D282 9'3" Concert Grand
      1977 Wurlitzer 200A

      Comment


      • #4
        In Sweden, the order of desirability (and thus value) would be something like this:

        * B-3 - the one that everybody wants, but nobody can afford due to really inflated prices
        * C-3/A-100 - the C-3 being slightly more expensive but it's a tie
        * RT-3/D-100 - too rare to estimate in this country, but would fit here in the "pecking order"
        * Old consoles such as CVs, BCs etc
        * M-series and E-100 series. Very different instruments, but about the same monetary value.
        * H-100 series. Not very many out there, but those that are sell very cheap as demand is very low
        * L-100 series. There's a _million_ of them out there, and they are sort of desirable to many, but are very cheap and hardly even worth working on if your goal is to restore and re-sell; you'll never get back even what the parts cost you.
        * T-series. These are the only tonewheel models that pop up for free here
        * Solid state models - any model really - are really really low in demand and therefore virtually impossible to sell.
        Current organs: AV, M-3, A-100
        Current Leslies: 22H, 122, 770

        Comment


        • #5
          I'd certainly put the A100 at the top of my list. I have never liked the Victorian kitchen table appearance of the B3, though I realise that people who play pedals in public expect that their audiences enjoy seeing their feet work.
          And pedals do keep the feet off nasty cold damp stone floors.

          Comment


          • #6
            I have said... The world of Hammond players are having an affair with the 'legs' of the B3. That simple...
            I rebuild Hammonds and Leslies. Please visit my website. tbstonewheels.com It's still in the works but is up and running. My personal setup is a Model A # 2203 with Trek II percussion, 122RV and 2 31h's. One is fitted with two speed motors and the other a Hamptone. Also sporting a working Vibratone 30A # 326.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Drummer55 View Post
              I have said... The world of Hammond players are having an affair with the 'legs' of the B3. That simple...
              That, and the myth.
              Current organs: AV, M-3, A-100
              Current Leslies: 22H, 122, 770

              Comment


              • #8
                For me, the best solution would be C2 with smooth DB, mine got ratched,Trek2 Perkussion, for it has 2", 3" as m100 and even 5". Trek2 reverb, all one one signal, combined with Leslie 122 or 147, wait for it. now 760.
                No preamp necessary. Axel
                C2 1953, as old as I am and 760 rebuilt, Custom M3 1955, custom HX3, Hohner OAB, Ventilator, Service for friends on A100, B3, BV, M100 and some Leslies

                Comment


                • #9
                  I know it's a myth about the B3. That has been reiterated in this forum for years.

                  There are a number of things I really wanted in life. Like, when I was younger, a Mercedes sports convertible. Aesthetics. Later in life, a salesman brought one out to our home. When I actually drove it, I didn't like it. A la B.B. King, the thrill was gone. There are some other things I really wanted, but once I had them, the thrill was also gone.

                  I really like good silk neckties. Understated but rich colours, thoughtful design, that sort of thing. I have looked at thousands of them. I have found a small number that are just perfect for me, and I still really like them. The thrill is not gone.

                  When I played drums in a Toronto band, we had an M series. But the big guys coming through had B3's. So when I found a B3 for a great price, I have never gotten over it. It doesn't really sound or play better than my previous C3. Same with my subsequent A100. It's a box on legs. Maybe a little coffin-like. And Hammond did really make coffins for a while. But I do like the legs. Why? Not because I'm narcissistic enough to want people to see my legs in action. But because a golden retriever likes to run through them, activating a bunch of pedals, seems to like all the noise, so circles around a couple of times mashing them, then lies on them like a prima donna. And I have to push in those drawbars as the dog warms my feet.

                  I have seen a video of Joey deFrancesco playing his A102 in his bedroom (or so the caption goes). Leslie 145, not a 122. What does this mean? Maybe nothing. You should ask him.
                  1955 B3, Leslie 21H and 147. Hammond A100 with weird Leslie 205. 1976 Rhodes. Wurlitzer 200A. Yamaha DX7/TX7. Korg M1. Yamaha C3 grand, 67 Tele blond neck, Les Paul Standard, PRS 24, Gibson classical electric, Breedlove acoustic electric, Strat, P Bass, Rogers drum kit, Roland TD 12 digital drums, Apollo quad, older blackfaced Fender Twin, other amps, mics and bits and pieces cluttering up the "studio."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I also wonder if it was the presumably lesser weight of a B-3, what with the spindle legs, etc., that made it more popular? Thoughts on the subject?
                    sigpic
                    1956 Hammond C-3
                    Circa 1965 Leslie 145
                    1963 Hammond D-152
                    1963 Hammond C-3
                    1959 Hammond HR-40 Tone Cabinet
                    Motion Sound Pro 3
                    Motion Sound Low Pro
                    1958 Hammond M-3
                    C.Bechstein D282 9'3" Concert Grand
                    1977 Wurlitzer 200A

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Doctor Robert View Post
                      I also wonder if it was the presumably lesser weight of a B-3, what with the spindle legs, etc., that made it more popular? Thoughts on the subject?
                      The weight difference is too small to make a real logistic difference; and the spindly legs aren't really an asset - as long as the organ is moved using dollies (which 90% of people do). The reason being that the B3, with it legs, has such a wide stance that putting the thing on dollies is much more difficult. On a C-3 or A-100, you just tilt the organ slightly and slide the dolly in one end at a time (no lifting required); but the B-3 doesn't tilt - it starts sliding on the floor instead so requires much more muscle to get it on the dollies.

                      So, when it comes to "ease of moving" - the A-100 is the easiest because it is narrower and passes thru doors easily. Then comes the C-3 because of the above, and the B-3 comes last.
                      Current organs: AV, M-3, A-100
                      Current Leslies: 22H, 122, 770

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        B-3 425 lbs
                        C-3 450 lbs
                        A100 381 lbs

                        I wouldn't want to carry any of them up a flight of stairs! Both B-3 and C-3 provide a coffin like container to put the squashed 'organ mover' in when it lands on top of them... At least the A100 will get through doorways a little bit easier.

                        What makes anything more popular than the next? Marketing, visibility, myth, legend, looks, legs etc. who cares? It doesn't matter. It is the sound that is important (and, being hand-built, every Hammond will have its own variations). Is it better to have a highly polished B-3 cabinet that sounds pretty ordinary -vs- a beaut sounding organ that has been around the traps a little. Are you looking for a museum piece or a beast to take out on the road? Everyone will have their own perspective on what feels good and suits their ears, needs and pocket.

                        How long is a piece of string?
                        1966 C-3 / 925
                        1965 M102 / 145
                        1967 M111A / 330

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          [QUOTE=peterb_2795;494223]B-3 425 lbs
                          C-3 450 lbs
                          A100 381 lbs

                          Please forgive my ignorance, but do the above weights include the pedalboard and bench? (I'm assuming they don't.)
                          sigpic
                          1956 Hammond C-3
                          Circa 1965 Leslie 145
                          1963 Hammond D-152
                          1963 Hammond C-3
                          1959 Hammond HR-40 Tone Cabinet
                          Motion Sound Pro 3
                          Motion Sound Low Pro
                          1958 Hammond M-3
                          C.Bechstein D282 9'3" Concert Grand
                          1977 Wurlitzer 200A

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            They do, yes
                            1966 C-3 / 925
                            1965 M102 / 145
                            1967 M111A / 330

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              As a refugee from the combo organ, garage-band days, I remember thinking that the B3 didn't look like a "church" organ and therefore looked cool on stage. As for unsung heroes, I love my AV. Perfect size but still the console look. I think I've got it clear in my head how to overcome the obstacles in adding Trek II percussion so that's my Feb 2019 project. (retiring Jan 31)

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