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Retractable Caster Wheels for C-3?

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  • #16
    What's the flooring you're moving them around on?

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    • #17
      The more I ponder this, putting wheels ON the organ cabinet itself is like strapping roller blades on your 90 year old grandmother.

      It will look ok until it comes time to move it around.

      Snap, crackle and pop!
      Click image for larger version

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      Best to design something that carries the organ from spot to spot instead of expecting the cabinet to absorb the torsion of carrying itself around.

      Then if you expect to use pedals as well, is another problem.

      One would have to do due diligence and properly move the organ and then set it up at each spot.

      Quickie solutions are not always useful for a Hammond console.

      Click image for larger version

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      This grandma is built to kill though.

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      • #18
        I see no major mechanical difference (torsion absorption-wise) between putting wheels directly on an organ cabinet, or using a set of Roll-Or-Karis.
        Current organs: AV, BC, A-100
        Current Leslies: 22H, 142, 147, 760
        Organs in the past: L-100 (several), M-100 (x2), T-100, E-100, CV
        Other keyboards: Roland FP-4, Yamaha DX7, Yamaha TX81Z, Yamaha Motif ES Rack, Korg Krome, Novation Mininova

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        • #19
          Originally posted by enor View Post
          I see no major mechanical difference (torsion absorption-wise) between putting wheels directly on an organ cabinet, or using a set of Roll-Or-Karis.
          The ROK's support the organ and are the spine (skeleton).

          With the straps in place the organ is compressed tightly up against the ROK's and when moving the organ with the ROK's under tension, the torsion is evenly distributed with most of the stress going to the ROK's. The organ is resting on its footprint on the ROK's, is sitting level at all four corners and moves in the same direction at the same time while on its feet.

          Like putting a cast on a broken leg. Note the video posted below.

          If you use the cabinet of the organ with wheels bolted to it, the stress points will be greater at the spot where the wheel brackets are and the spots at the bolts.

          If you're going to use wheels attached to the cabinet they should be BOLTS not screws and note the ad for the wheels shows a 3x3 as the mounting thickness for those wheels.
          Click image for larger version

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          These wood screws are going to rip right out!

          With the wheels attached to the cabinet, the cabinet will twist with 4 individual pressure points moving independently of each other, not in unison. The torsion will be unevenly dispersed across the cabinet vs the solid L bar that is bolted to the ROK handles that suspends/carries the organ, which keeps the organ taut and steady with no uneven stress working on the cabinet.

          The heavy duty angle bar is a spine on both sides of the organ.

          Look at the photo of the elderly roller blader. Look at the size of her legs.

          Now will the organ cabinet over time grow muscle mass to support independent wheel stress points?

          I don't think so. If anything, the cabinet will start to fall apart from uneven weight distribution, maybe even cracking the cabinet worse case scenario. Whatever bolts that hold the cabinet/organ together will need to be tightened.

          There are posts warning against drilling holes and compromising the organ's cabinet and its value. So there's that.

          The organ cabinet is old wood and it wasn't built to be portable and moved often.

          If the organ is to be moved often, I don't even advise 4 people moving the organ as that adds another scenario where 4 independent points will torque the cabinet with unequal pressure, each person hobbling along huffing and puffing to move a heavy cumbersome object.


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          Over time the flange will start digging into the wood. The bolts even if with a washer will be digging in the wood on the other side. Fine for an ordinary 3x3 block of wood, not so fine for a vintage organ cabinet.

          And then how easy will it be to engage the wheels if they are on the organ? It won't be two wheels at the same time (like on an ROK) it will be 4 wheels one at a time where further twisting of the console will occur.

          Like trying to change 4 flat tires on a single car using an old bumper jack instead of a large hydraulic jack on the differential.

          Jack each side up and down, twisting the chassis.

          And what do you grab onto while you try and engage that wheel to fulcrum that 300 plus pound instrument?

          If I may be blunt, it shows a lack of respect for the instrument to cursorily add wheels to the instrument.



          Now as usual, the instrument belongs to you, not us.

          At least we have given our opinions on the matter and caveat emptor.


          My 2¢
          Last edited by Goff; 11-07-2019, 10:16 AM.

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          • #20
            ROK, while a nice bit of gear, is expensive overkill for my purpose which is to simply move the organ around my workshop. I'm planning to make a platform with retractable casters on it. Furniture dollies put the organ too high off the floor for my purpose.
            -------

            Hammond M-102 #21000.
            Leslie 147 #F7453 in the queue.
            Hammond S-6 #72421

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            • #21
              I agree with preserving these instruments, but I also have no compunction in modifying my instrument to make it sound better, have more modern features or effects, or be easier to move. I considered these retractable wheels until a buddy of mine said, "Cool, but how would we load it?" He was referring to the loss of the large handles that the typical Hammond dollies provide. I suppose a similar handle could be made but I doubt a B3 or C3's wooden frame would hold up to the strain of such a handle mounted to its side. We play one night a week at the same club and actually keep the organ there, but have to roll it out each week, take it off the dollies, and then load it back on again and roll it back until next week. It gets old real quick. I've even considered building a wheeled stage for it. Actually, these retractable wheels would work perfectly for that application. Hmm... Anyway, has anyone used these retractable wheels attached to an organ and addressed the handle issue?
              Over the years: Hammond M3, BC, M102, B3, four X77s and three PR-40s, a Thomas Electra and a Celebrity, three Fender Rhodes, Roland HS-10, HP-2000, HP-600, RD-600, JV-880, a thing made by Korg (?), two Leslie 910s, 122, 257, 258, 247, two 142s, and three custom-built Leslies. Wow, way too much money spent!

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              • enor
                enor commented
                Editing a comment
                An alternative would be to simply leave your organ dollies on when playing - I kind of like that "rugged" look myself and rarely remove them.

            • #22
              enor commented:
              An alternative would be to simply leave your organ dollies on when playing - I kind of like that "rugged" look myself and rarely remove them.

              Yeah, I don't mind it either, especially if we could get them sprayed (or maybe powder coated) black. Currently they're red. They are an older pair, not made by Roll-Or-Kari (I don't think so anywa,) with a large handle that is pushed down to elevate the wheels. And, the other organist (and owner of the organ) just prefers not to have them in place during the gig. Go figure...
              Over the years: Hammond M3, BC, M102, B3, four X77s and three PR-40s, a Thomas Electra and a Celebrity, three Fender Rhodes, Roland HS-10, HP-2000, HP-600, RD-600, JV-880, a thing made by Korg (?), two Leslie 910s, 122, 257, 258, 247, two 142s, and three custom-built Leslies. Wow, way too much money spent!

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