Finally waiting for my - too young - Hammond B3

[giacomo_pagani]

Dear Folks,

Good old days with my father's L122 + 147 are now dating back a couple decades. I learned (kind of) Child In Time on that, and a few good things that my piano teacher taught me... On piano. It wasn't that great to keep following the course, but anyway.
After those days, a big dream of having a B-3 started growing and growing... Nostalgic, passionate, some sort of devotion towards my first and foremost love with music.

Do you know that a B-3 and a 122 Leslie go for about 10k EUR here in Italy? It's one of those things that "you should really live in the US".
That was the big hell of a problem.

This December, anyway, I pulled the trigger. According to the serial number (starting with "C", and easily confirmed by the engraved drawbars etc.), it's a 1971.
I made a deposit yesterday, I'm gonna pay in full before Christmas, and receive it fully serviced and one-year warranted within the end of the year.

Mostly after lurking on this forum, I must tell you, I was about to withdraw because of the manufacturing year.
I read many people writing that "past 69 is bad", quality dropped, etc.
I also see YouTube repair shops demoing their Hammonds and mentioning "crisp, bright, late-years sound" on stuff that young.

In the end, I bought the organ because of where it came from. It's being sold by number one Hammond genius in Italy, a guy whose name is Silvio Della Mattia, who provides Hammonds to Deep Purple (Don Airey) and many other big shows in town when they come to play in this Country.
As I already stated, it's no States here (sorry for that). No huge loads of Hammonds to handpick here, and you're damn lucky already if you can find one coming from reputable guys, who will know about foam issues and remove it without asking, who will know how to "voice" the organ and to properly maintain it. You are also "buying" the confidence of their knowledge and service.

Even like that, this post is here for you experts to yell freely at my B-3. It's been a long time since I read fresh posts of quality issues in the late years, and most importantly sound differences. Chime in and write what you have to write.
I listened to tons of YouTube videos and I'm not sure I can identify "worse sounding" new models in comparison to the beloved '50s samples.
I also see plenty of talented stars playing recent, engraved-drawbars machines without a less than stellar sound output.

What's your take then, on a properly serviced '70s Hammond?
Does it sound any different than any other red-capped Hammonds?

Pictures of my future new toy coming soon.

Cheers,

Giacomo

[Tonewheel]

Giacomo, congratulations on your purchase.

I am a Canadian living in Germany for 18 months, and I have seen what is available here, and it is not as pretty as back in North America. Your price for one that is fully gone over and warrantied is not that bad, in my opinion. There is a B3 and 122 for sale in Alberta, priced at $12,900. That price has now dropped, because nobody will buy it for that. But saw an ad for one the same year (now sold) as yours from HammondWorld at $10,500 US. But in Europe, to have a B3, I would think, would be like having a 1955 Mercedes Gull Wing.

I have Beauty in the B and I recall reading in it a comment that the later builds were of lesser quality for drawbars, cabinet, solder connections not great but the later tonewheels were better-sounding.

Not sure if you are looking for a dust-up with the professional repair colleagues here. Nobody is going to yell at you for buying a newer B3. I may be wrong, but you don't sound like you are going to throw this gem in a little diesel van and drive at 120 K over the cobblestones and country road potholes with the TWG bouncing around every weekend on gigs. You don't want to do that with a 1971 B3. Or any B3 for that matter. When I was in Toronto bands, I remember roadies telling me of them yelling, Oh, no the B3!" as they dropped the organ down the stairs in the clubs. Probably exaggerating...

But I have a 1955 B3 (and humble 21H) and LOVE it! Same thing. No jostling. TLC. Because the good book also says that the older ones may have problems too.

Why don't you just post the pics, send some nice sound samples, tell everyone here you love them, so that when something does fall apart after warranty, your friends here will remember you and jump in and help you.

Again, I think most of us here are happy for you in this uncommon victory in Europe. (Back to my B3 in 3 months!). B-)

[enor]

Actually, you can have about 50-60 of those 10k-dollars-B3s for the price of a 55 gullwing Merc here in Europe.

[giacomo_pagani]

Thank you for the very nice words here!
I cannot post anything yet because the organ is at the shop, ready to be cleaned and serviced before delivery.

I expect to have it in my room after Christmas.

The tech told me a similar thing: it's true there are some differences, but, in his opinion, the refined tonewheel (something about the 3rd octave, if I recall correctly... Maybe he was talking about the RC-filtering) is worth more than some lesser details. They also had a 1959 C-3 at the shop (which was really tempting to me) but both the seller and the tech had no doubt saying which one sounded better to them: that '71.
He also said that, once recapped, the older '59 would have sounded just about as bright as the newer, which is not really a matter or bright vs warm, but "complete" vs "dull" instead.

But anyway, I'm still interested to hear what people think nowadays about this matter.

On my part, I can't wait to put my hands on the thing...

Giacomo

[enor]

Have the foam strips been removed from the manuals of this '71?

Personally, given the choice between a '59 and a '71 I'd grab the '59 without thinking twice, due to the foam free manuals and the nicer looking cabinet. But that said, a '71 can be a great sounding box. I absolutely love the sound of my '68 A-100 which is pretty much the same as your '71.

[giacomo_pagani]

Have the foam strips been removed from the manuals of this '71?

Personally, given the choice between a '59 and a '71 I'd grab the '59 without thinking twice, due to the foam free manuals and the nicer looking cabinet. But that said, a '71 can be a great sounding box. I absolutely love the sound of my '68 A-100 which is pretty much the same as your '71.

Yes, the foam will be removed as part of the service/setup of the instrument.

Note that the '59 is a C-3, with quatrefoil; it's nice, for sure, but not as sleek as a B-3 at home.
I know woods were usually nicer in the earlier days, but still the C-3 is aesthetically much "heavier" and wouldn't win in the house.

My only concerns, to be honest, are sound-wise.

[enor]

Yes, the foam will be removed as part of the service/setup of the instrument.

Note that the '59 is a C-3, with quatrefoil; it's nice, for sure, but not as sleek as a B-3 at home.
I know woods were usually nicer in the earlier days, but still the C-3 is aesthetically much "heavier" and wouldn't win in the house.

My only concerns, to be honest, are sound-wise.

Oooh, Lord... I _SO_ would have grabbed the '59. A quatrefoil C-3 is, to me, the ultimate Hammond - looks-wise. But, to each his own! :)

Good luck with your new "pal"! I'm sure you'll be very happy with it.

[Tonewheel]

Enor, I have always loved that gullwing, but the price I see is upwards of 1.3M Euros. So I have a plastic model here. The doors open and the front wheels steer. I try too make the right sounds.

So a good Hammond, and I'm happy.

[Alek Z]

Albeit this knowledge is only based on watching videos and info sources from techs, but I have found that the later B3's are still highly regarded (then again that's coming from techs trying to sell them...). Though I've never noticed a substantial difference in sound quality (again, only from videos and audio files), and I think I'd be just a pleased with a serviced later B3 as I would with an earlier B3. Especially given your circumstances, I think you should be happy with the purchase, and I hope you are or will be in time!

[muckelroy]

As long as you have it de-foamed, and are prepared to service somewhat more breakable parts (drawbar contacts, pedal pushers), yes they are fine instruments, even the late models.

[giacomo_pagani]

Today I came back to the shop, to finish my payment. I met a great musician there, who was happy to play the B3 for me... It sounded great! Lots of sparkle and punch, chimey Hammond sound down to the bone.

No videos unfortunately, but I'll post a few ugly photos...

[tpappano]

Wow! Super great shape, congratulations!

[handyczech]

The speaker has extra louvers indicating it should be a 122RV. Ask them if the reverb still works or has been fixed. Either way this package looks great.

[NittyRanks]

benvenuto al forum giacomo

[giacomo_pagani]

The speaker has extra louvers indicating it should be a 122RV. Ask them if the reverb still works or has been fixed. Either way this package looks great.

Yeah, didn't I mention it?
I was offered both models (122 and 122RV)... Of course the reverb works and the whole Leslie will be serviced like the organ, they should be working on 'em these days.
For a few bucks more, I chose the RV, thinking it would have been nicer, using its reverb for some more sound shaping.
What do you think?

And thank you folks for chiming in and welcoming me to the forum.
Cheers from a cold morning on the Lago Maggiore.

[Papus]

Nice score!
I have a 122-V. It's got the extra louvres and mounting holes for the reverb amp, ready for post-purchase upgrade which the previous owner never did.
The advantage of a 122-V or RV is the horn compartment is quite a bit taller than a regular 122, this allows you to remove or swap the horn without needing to drop the V21 treble driver from below. Simply loosen the belt and pop the horn out.
Now you can easily experiment between a horn with deflectors or without deflectors :)

[giacomo_pagani]

Thank you Papus, I was looking into the RV peculiarities and found out that Gregg Allman was fond of the sound of the 122RV, probably due to the different treble horns chamber.
Do you have experience about any differences in sound from a regular 122?

[giacomo_pagani]

Dear folks,

The wait is over.
Italian organ master Silvio Della Mattia did real magic on restoring these things and the sound is gorgeous.
I'm crazy happy and I also find the 122RV reverb to be nice: it's a tad bright and razory in general, but well suited for recreating some of those A Whiter Shade Of Pale effects etc.

Some pics attached.