Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!

[Guest]

Hi everyone, I'm a newbie here but have lurked as a visitor for a while!</p>

I have a neighbor who's mother recently passed away and she had a Hammond M-111 which was purchased new in 1963. I am told the organ is in excellent condition, has manuals, was recently oiled and works great. It used to have a Leslie but it was "too big for the living room so they gave it to the Goodwill." LOL</p>

Anyway, I want to be fair and am interested in the organ. Can anyone offer me an idea of the value of this model? I want to be fair to everyone if I decide to buy it.</p>

Also, any special considerations in moving it?</p>

Thank you very much!
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[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



This is what I'd do...offer $50 after pointing out the obvious exterior blemishes and the fact that you may very well have to replace the tubes... etc.. it's been in the opinion of circles I frequent that the higher the M or L model number... the lamer the organ.... *Rhythm Machine = Wal-Mart Casio keyboard*... the one you're looking at doesn't have that I believe....</P>


I looked at a site and noticed that it's mahogany...*M-111*</P>


It kind of reminds me of my L-103 a little bit... pay $100 if you have too.... ;)</P>

[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



Hi BC. The M3 and M-100s are the most desirable of the spinets (at least for folks looking for the "baby B3" sound), but even so, spinets just aren't worth much these days. </p>

If your neighbor's M-111 is indeed in excellent condition both cosmetically and mechanically, I'd say it'd be worth between $100 and $200.</p>

As far as moving it goes, the first thing you'll want to do is lock the tone generator down. HammondWiki has good info on that and other moving tips at http://www.dairiki.org/HammondWiki/MovingAHammond</p>

Good luck with the M-111! Let us know how things work out.</p>

[stefanv]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



I just picked up a 1962 M-111 is very good cosmetic condition (just a few blemishes), but with a stuck vibrato and a 60Hz hum in the reverb. The seller was asking $600. After a bit of negotiating, we settled on $100. I plan to have some fun overhauling this baby beastie.</p>


Stefan</p>

[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!

How did you go from $600 to $100? Did you mention that you're Italian or something?

[Clarion]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



Anyway, I want to be fair and am interested in the organ. Can anyone offer me an idea of the value of this model? I want to be fair to everyone if I decide to buy it.</P>


Absolutely Zero! You will be doing them a favour by taking it off of their hands without incurring the expense of hiring a junk dealer do accomplish the very same purpose.</P>

[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!

[quote user="Clarion"]


Absolutely Zero! You will be doing them a favour by taking it off of their hands without incurring the expense of hiring a junk dealer do accomplish the very same purpose.</p>

[/quote]</p>

Well, I know they want to sell it and there are other people interested. I think they would prefer selling it to me since I was a "friend." I'm thinking from what I have been told that $150 would be the number.
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[stefanv]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



[quote user="NoahBenzing"]How did you go from $600 to $100? Did you mention that you're Italian or something?[/quote]</p>


No, I mentioned that I did some research (asking around on the various Hammond lists and such), and that the going rate for a working M-100 series organ was between $0 and $100. This was just in my initial e-mail. By the time I went to go see it, they had also done some research, and were willing to settle for $150, but then I discovered the stuck vibrato and such, so we agreed on $100.</p>


I think they simply had no idea what the going rate for an old M-111 is. They weren't musicians or Hammond aficionados. The organ was just passed down from generation to generation. For all I know, they might have asked $600 if it had been a B-3 or A-100 too.
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[stefanv]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



[quote user="Clarion"]Absolutely Zero![/quote]</p>

It's only worth Zero if no one wants to buy it.</p>

[OrgansR4Me]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



I just let my M103 go for $80 and had only 1 serious inquiry.(I included replacement tubes and replacement voicing tabs worth the price of the sale) People weren't exactly beating down my door to get a Hammond! As others have said, if the family considers you a "friend" they should want to you have it for the least they can accept. If you are willing to pay $150 after trying the instrument that is very generous on your part. They had been willing to give away the Leslie, why not the organ?</P>


It would have been much better if they had let the organ go at the same time as the Leslie. The combination was worth much more than the organ alone. One reason I sold mine was the attempt to arrange a Leslie connection and refurbish the parts was mounting close to $400. I decided to put money into another organ rather than purchase the connector kit since the Leslie I acquired was an untested thrift store find.</P>


If you are purchasing this instrument for it's B3 similarity it won't be complete without the Leslie and should be priced accordingly! We wish you well and welcome you to the forum!</P>
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[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!

[quote user="OrgansR4Me"]

I just let my M103 go for $80 and had only 1 serious inquiry.(I included replacement tubes and replacement voicing tabs worth the price of the sale) People weren't exactly beating down my door to get a Hammond! As others have said, if the family considers you a "friend" they should want to you have it for the least they can accept. If you are willing to pay $150 after trying the instrument that is very generous on your part. They had been willing to give away the Leslie, why not the organ?</p>


It would have been much better if they had let the organ go at the same time as the Leslie. The combination was worth much more than the organ alone. One reason I sold mine was the attempt to arrange a Leslie connection and refurbish the parts was mounting close to $400. I decided to put money into another organ rather than purchase the connector kit since the Leslie I acquired was an untested thrift store find.</p>


If you are purchasing this instrument for it's B3 similarity it won't be complete without the Leslie and should be priced accordingly! We wish you well and welcome you to the forum!</p>
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The Leslie went away a LONG time ago apparently. The organ stayed and was maintained as it should so it purely was a space issue I guess. I think they wanted $200 because of the condition but whereas it may be wonderful looking, I don't know if that alone makes it worth it.</p>

O.k., this is a bit of a left turn into a whole different conversation but since you mentioned this:</p>

"If you are purchasing this instrument for it's B3 similarity it won't be complete without the Leslie"</p>

I'm still in newbie territory so forgive this question: Is there such a thing as a poor man's B3? Looking over all these models, I wonder if there is one that people gravitate to? That said, is the sound completely dependent on the Leslie or are there models that simulate the Leslie effect through built in effects?</p>

Yes, please forgive the newbie. Thank you.
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[OrgansR4Me]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



The M series were very much admired for the ability to imitate the B3 sound when connected to a leslie. In technology today, yes there are electronic Leslie simulators, but at that time there was none. My reading of the history of rock bands, though I'm actually too old to be a part of that culture, is that they like the greater portability of the spinet for what they termed "gigging" or playing gigs that were mostly one night stands on lengthy road trips. A couple of strong young fellows could manhandle the M's in and out of the truck or van.</P>


Some Hammond history sites accredit a number of well known recordings to the M's and in a recent magazine article I was reading one of the supporting photo's showed the artist in a recording studio and right behind her was the faithful M (and this is a current photo not history!)</P>


Others are more qualified to tell you about the possibilities of adding a simulator to the M if you should acquire it. As far as the family having priced the organ at $200, regrettably very few sellers have a geniune knowledge of the value of an older instrument. They are most often swayed by ridiculous ads requesting big bucks for "antique" instruments. Having followed Ebay for a long time, I can assure you most of them never sell at the inflated price.</P>


If you want it and they want to liquidate the estate, $100 would cover the excellent condition!</P>

[Guest]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



Well, I may offer the $150 to help the family out because they might need the few extra $ - that said, can I ask for advice as to where to begin learning and determining what type of Leslie I may want to look for - it appears there are about a jillion different ones.</p>

Thanks for all the info, I appreciate it!
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[OrgansR4Me]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!

Great question. That proved to be one of the complications in my attempt to put my M on a leslie.I didn't do my homework. I found a Leslie and bought it right then! Like you, I was uninformed and made a very poor selection. My Leslie is a 22H single speed. ( And since I'm into Theater tone more than jazz or rock that would have worked for me.) The most recommended model for the M series is the 122 and if you already have the correct connector kit left in the organ from old installation you've probably made your purchase worthwhile right there. New connector kits run in excess of $250! Are any half moon switches still installed with the organ or did they go with the Leslie? They allow you to choose between the Leslie, Internal speakers, or both and a second allows you to choose fast or slow on the Leslie Motor Speed. If you've listened to organist switch back and forth and you want to imitate that sound, the half moon isthe traditional method. New ones would be included with a complete kit so if not that isn't a problem.

[Hammond101]

Re: Help! Advice and value on a 1963 M-111! Help please!



BC,</P>


An M100 could be considered a poor man's Hammond. Also the M3, E100 and even the A100 (the latter 2 are full consoles) and others, too many to list. There really is no such thing as a poor man's Leslie. The perfect match for an M100 would be a Leslie model 251. They bring about $750-$1250. Then you need a connection kit for your Console. Other single channel, two rotor,single speed Leslies are also satisfactory. Price of admission is typically $500 and above.</P>


Effects pedals can be used as a substitute and smaller single rotor Leslies can be had for less but all this is a compromise in sound to keep the wallet happy. Who knows, you might walk into a Goodwill store and find a nice Leslie that was donated! It happens all the time just not to me. I've had much better luck with free or nearly free Hammonds.</P>


If the M100 you're considering is in living room condition and everything works, I would think it could be a bit more valueable than the standard $100 Hammond spinet. I see them sell for more all the time. The value of any vintage instrument is set by what ever someone is willing to pay. I sold an M111 on ebay about 3 years ago for about $250. It was perfect electronically. The cabinet was clean but had a few dings. My current M101 (mint)was given to me, free, as was my RT3 (near mint). I sold an A100 with a Leslie 51 for $1800 also a 1955 M3 with a JR 120 tone cab for $250.And so it goes. The M100 is my favorite Hammond spinet. It is a good place to start in the Hammond world. Finding one that works correctly and has been properly maintained through the years is a bonus worth a few $$ IMO.</P>


Best of luck whatever you decide,</P>


H101</P>