Will there be any organ brands left in ten years?

[daryljeffreyl]

With low world-wide sales of all types of organs, it is not surprising that the Lowrey Organ brand is latest fatality. Allen Organ are still being manufactured in the United States. Allen makes church, theater, and studio digital organs. How long they remain manufacturing organs is anyone guess, with low world-wide organ sales. Even church organs are not selling well in the United States. I assume that sales and installations of pipe organs, world-wide, are also very low. Will there be any organ brands left, in ten years, to buy?

[seamaster]

Just Hammond.

[KC9UDX]

Ten years isn't that far away. Surely Allen and Viscount will still be round. I missed the boat to say this in that other thread, but I wouldn't be shocked if Viscount bought the Lowrey name. That would give them presence in all the markets they're currently weak in.

[andyg]

I expect a few classical makes to still be around and Allen will probably still be making a few theatre models. And as I wouldn't class Hammond as a home organ any more, I'm afraid to say that the answer may well be no. Clonewheels will be around until the market becomes saturated. After that, it's anyone's guess, as no company, not even a big one like Suzuki, will want to run a division at a loss or minimal returns.

What is all the 'buzz' about Viscount buying the Lowrey name? I personally can't see why anyone would want to enter the home organ market. Outlay - huge, returns - likely to be minimal. And though Viscount's experience with home organs was long, it was a long time ago now, and to be honest most of their organs weren't exactly spectacular back then.

Now all this has been said in other threads. Can anyone come up with something new?

[merlinhx]

How are Organ sales holding up in Asia Pacific? If there is a strong sales nucleus somewhere there is always a chance...…...

[abacus]

Yamaha still sells well in Asia, as does Ringway, due to the fact they have a different perspective on music compared to the west, so I guess they will still be around there.

In the west, Hammond and those that make classical/church organs will probably still be around, plus Orla/Ringway could still be around due to high sales in Asia. Wersi, Bohm & Bemore could also still be around as they are already niche low (But steady) volume production instruments, plus as most of them are software based, it is far easier and cheaper to continually update with new features and sounds, but in truth nobody knows what the future will bring, as nobody has ever managed it in the past.

A case in point is the poll on what manufactures are likely to fail in the next few years, that was posted on the forum a number of years ago, the ones that everyone said would be the first to fail are still going strong, but the solid manufactures have gone. (Even Lowrey lasted longer than the stalwarts)

Bill

[voet]

In another thread, Arie V stated:

Johannus figures have gone up, due to them acquiring Rodgers. The former Rodgers President mentioned about 5 or 6 years thatRodgers was making 400 organs per year. About the same time Johannus had an order rate of around 1,400 units.

In an interview the president of Allen said they were producing approx 800 organs per year. Twenty or so years ago Allen was making over 2,000 units.

I heard from somone in the know, that Viscount production was around 1,000 units.


Best case, this is less than 5,000 units for the leading companies producing classic style digital organs. This world wide market is not large enough to entice new entrants, and since we have been hearing for a long time that unit sales are on the decline, I think we can all figure out what that portends. The best hope would be if young people became interested in discovering the lost art of organ playing. I got my instrument from a family that had purchased it for their son who expressed an interest in learning to play the organ. When he got tired of that notion, they decided to sell it.

[sweet melody 79]

I wonder if the price of the Roland 900 Platinum has changed?. I sold mine as i was scared it would not hold value in a few years. At the mo i am organ-less, I have a Yamaha Genos and a Yamaha Montage 88 key so i have a two keyboard set up. Both are exceptional boards!

[seamaster]

Wersi, Bohm & Bemore could also still be around

No chance.

[abacus]

No chance.

You have been saying that for as long as I can remember, and it still hasn’t happened, but your beloved Roland which you said (Or at least implied) would easily outlast Wersi, Bohm & Bemore has gone.
I rest my case.

Bill

[andyg]

I wonder if the price of the Roland 900 Platinum has changed?. I sold mine as i was scared it would not hold value in a few years. At the mo i am organ-less, I have a Yamaha Genos and a Yamaha Montage 88 key so i have a two keyboard set up. Both are exceptional boards!

I'd have hung on to the Platinum, Chris. Yes, the value will drop - all organs do, the minute you buy them and discontinuation of production has an effect, for sure. But, unless you bought it, planning to sell it on fairly quickly, you'll be missing the enjoyment that you could have had from it over the next few years. Major parts should be OK for another 7 years under US laws and there's no reason why the organs shouldn't carry on beyond that.

A Genos/Montage double stack set up makes some fine sounds, I've tried it, but it's not the same as playing the Roland.

On the upside, in a year's time you may be able to buy one back again for less than you sold yours for, so maybe your logic holds! :)

[seamaster]

You have been saying that for as long as I can remember, and it still hasn’t happened, but your beloved Roland which you said (Or at least implied) would easily outlast Wersi, Bohm & Bemore has gone. I rest my case.

You make my point for me. If Roland couldn't make money out of flogging home organs, with a great brand, a vast dealer network and all the benefits of an integrated manufacturing business, Fritz, Franz and Bram are on borrowed time at best.

[sweet melody 79]

I'd have hung on to the Platinum, Chris. Yes, the value will drop - all organs do, the minute you buy them and discontinuation of production has an effect, for sure. But, unless you bought it, planning to sell it on fairly quickly, you'll be missing the enjoyment that you could have had from it over the next few years. Major parts should be OK for another 7 years under US laws and there's no reason why the organs shouldn't carry on beyond that.

A Genos/Montage double stack set up makes some fine sounds, I've tried it, but it's not the same as playing the Roland.

On the upside, in a year's time you may be able to buy one back again for less than you sold yours for, so maybe your logic holds! :)

Hi Andy, If i am honest someone actually offered me $6,000 more than i paid for it so i really did strike it lucky. I am very happy with my combo and your right they do make some very fine sounds. Actually i dont think you could find better on any organ. The only thing is like you said it is not an organ and it is hard to adjust. I am sure at some point i will get a 900P. I have put in nearly $10,000 for my two keyboard set up so in a year or so i might even be able to do a trade in and not have to spend too much more for the 900P

[KC9UDX]

What is all the 'buzz' about Viscount buying the Lowrey name? I personally can't see why anyone would want to enter the home organ market.

I don't think they would. But if they did, I wouldn't be shocked. I'll be shocked if anyone else does. I think the odds of anyone buying it are slim to none. I think the odds of anyone selling them profitably is zero.

The best hope would be if young people became interested in discovering the lost art of organ playing.

How would you convince someone that the cheap keyboards they call "pianos" can't do everything they'd want to do with a real organ?

[dressur4]

With low world-wide sales of all types of organs, it is not surprising that the Lowrey Organ brand is latest fatality. Allen Organ are still being manufactured in the United States. Allen makes church, theater, and studio digital organs. How long they remain manufacturing organs is anyone guess, with low world-wide organ sales. Even church organs are not selling well in the United States. I assume that sales and installations of pipe organs, world-wide, are also very low. Will there be any organ brands left, in ten years, to buy?

As I stated on the Lowrey forum The reason why the organ is dying is that the church or classical organ world and the Theatre organ world (at least in the US not sure about the UK so not meaning them) they are snobs and Allen unlike Lowrey don't have any real courses or focus on the adult who is either already a musician (like myself) or wants to become one. Also the focus on Piano only students is also the problem there are a lot more guitar and string musicians than pianists or organist so keep insulting the non piano musician and you kill potential buyers of organ. I was told in an Allen music shop in Nevada that I am too old to be really any good since I don't play piano . even though I know music theory and mastered the banjo and play like Bela Fleck who's teacher also taught me. I still am too old to learn and become really that good So I said take your theatre organs grind them up put them in an enema bad and ,, well you get the idea. So that is the reason why organ is dying off plus the focus on sports in this country in schools and the evisceration of the music programs in schools in favor of football and basketball and this ball and that ball . is also the reason why it's dying. I lay all the blame on the elitists in the AGO and the ATOS and the focus on the young student who's parents can't afford a new large Lowrey like the older folks . The LDS church has a free organ primer coarse for the PIANIST however I have more than enough music theory to understand and get the material The Catholic Church don't have that they have elitists playing and they are dying off and the guitar and the piano are the main instruments in the Catholic Church they have no courses to encourage people to step up and learn God can do miracles and let any adult learn and be a great. But that is why organs are going by by it's the attitude and also music tastes if you can call it that now a days isn't conducive to the organ either. can you play rap music on an organ or this bubble gum garbage the youth are enthralled with? at least with Sinatra music you can play it on the organ even Beatles music you can play . So that is why it's dying. It's tragic but reality So unless the attitudes change with the AGO and the ATOS folks meaning the players it will continue to die out even more. Allen needs to get busy and quickly come up with ways to keep customers interested in the organ like get a program together to encourage people to buy and learn.. That is my take on it. Just because a musician didn't learn piano don't mean he/she can't learn the organ takes as much if not more dexterity to play a guitar like Chet Atkins or banjo like Bela fleck as it does to play piano. and I do get offended when organists don't take us stringed musicians seriously. So I am not really in love with the organ crowd to begin with and harbor some resentments against the whole organ world but I will win and then show them all.... I hope the attitudes do change then the organ will thrive