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Need Help getting Line-Level Signal out of Conn Serenade 633 Organ

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  • Need Help getting Line-Level Signal out of Conn Serenade 633 Organ

    So there is an "Electro Music 251 Tone Cabinet", 6-pin female jack on the power supply
    of my Conn 633 organ:
    Click image for larger version  Name:	20201016_010745.jpg Views:	0 Size:	289.3 KB ID:	744836
    It appears to have the same pin-outs as the Leslie 251, and when
    I hooked my o'scope to pin 5, I appear to get a good signal, from
    both the 2 manuals, and the bass foot pedals. There is also a signal on
    pin 6, but the bass pedals seem to be MUCH louder than the manuals,
    on this particular pin.

    What is the reason for the difference in the two pins? I assume pin 6 is
    meant to mainly amplify the bass pedals, and should go to some sort of
    sub-woofer? Which pin should I use, to go to an external reverb unit, and
    my keyboard amp? I would like to amplify both the 2 manuals, and the
    bass pedals, equally.

    Also, I was worried that it looked like you could insert the male plug the
    wrong way, but after looking at some pics, it appears two of the pins have
    a larger diameter than the others, to prevent incorrect insertion, right?

    And is this the correct male plug to buy, if I want to install a 1/4" female jack
    into this organ?

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Vintage-6...oAAOSw1rxc9XEP

    Thanks for any good advice!
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Paul789; 10-16-2020, 03:26 AM.

  • #2
    Ok, this explains it pretty well:

    http://www.organplus.com/technique/l...lesli251um.pdf

    Although I seem to be getting the pedal voices on both channels (pins 5 and 6).

    I supposed what I will do, is listen to each signal, and decide which one is best
    for adding reverb, and then amplifying with my Roland keyboard amp. If I feel
    I will need both signals, I'll just put them through a small mixer first.

    Comment


    • #3
      You will want to mix the two signals before you reverberate and amplify them. One is the "string" or "pulse" channel and the other is the "flute" channel. As you note, the pedals play in both channels. But you'll have a serious imbalance if you only use one or the other. Both are in fact full-range channels, even if it seems that one is heavy on the bass. That would be only because the pedals happen to be turned up louder in that channel, or that is the "flute" channel, which by definition is bassier.
      John
      ----------
      *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!

      https://www.facebook.com/pages/Birds...97551893588434

      Comment


      • #4
        Ok, I've gotten both signals on pins 5 and 6 mixed, reverberated, and amplified, and I am
        very pleased with the results. Now I have to build a simple 6-pin amphenol Leslie connector,
        to two 1/4" mono female instrument jacks, in some sort of metal project box.

        I bought an old male Leslie connector came from Ebay, but I don't know how to remove the
        sheath:

        Click image for larger version

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        Do I fit a screwdriver in the slot, under that dimple, and pry it off? I don't
        want to damage it! But I need to access the pins, so I can remove the
        wires coming from pins 3 and 4, so that I won't have 120 Volts AC, dangerously
        exposed on the wires.

        I also want to solder two audio cables to pins 5, 6, and 1 (ground), to go to the
        1/4" instrument jacks. Should I use shielded audio cable for this job? That
        might be overkill, because the audio wires don't look shielded, coming from the
        innards of the organ, but it might make me feel better!

        Thanks for any good advice!
        Attached Files

        Comment


        • #5
          Ok, for any other newbies out there: Yes, the Leslie connector's metal sheath is easily
          removed by prying it off with a screwdriver.

          And I ended up just cannibalizing an audio/video cable I had lying around, by
          cutting off the video connectors, and the audio RCA connectors on one side. Then I
          tied a knot into the end I had cut off, and used a tie-wrap to reinforce the knot, so
          there will be strain-relief if someone ever yanks or trips on the cord:
          Click image for larger version

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          Then I removed all the wires soldered to the 3 pins I will not use (the two AC voltage pins, and the
          tremolo relay pin), and bent loops into the remaining wires, to create a bit of mechanical strength,
          and not relying completely on solder strength:
          Click image for larger version

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          Then I soldered the two grounds to pin 1, and the audio signal wires to pins 5 and 6, and
          replaced the metal sheath (it's harder to put back on, than to take it off!).

          And, Voila! I have a Leslie 251 connector to two RCA outputs:
          Click image for larger version

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          Attached Files

          Comment


          • #6
            That output is going to be hot, at speaker level, to drive a 251. You'll need to pad it down a fair amount to get to line level.
            It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

            New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

            Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
            Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
            Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
            Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by andyg View Post
              That output is going to be hot, at speaker level, to drive a 251. You'll need to pad it down a fair amount to get to line level.
              The microphone gain trim pots on my Mackie mixer are turned down, but not completely, and there is no
              noticeable distortion at all. I ended up turning on the 75Hz Low Cut on both channels.

              Comment


              • #8
                There's still a mismatch and I don't like having to turn trim pots down that far, but if it's working fine then fine!
                It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

                New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

                Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
                Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
                Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
                Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

                Comment


                • #9
                  The Leslie 251 still amplifies the signals on pins 5 and 6, before they reach the speakers:

                  Click image for larger version  Name:	251.gif Views:	0 Size:	74.3 KB ID:	746203
                  Attached Files
                  Last edited by Paul789; 10-31-2020, 08:19 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Wow - cool information. My 643 has the same connector on the amp (and two more connectors on the sidewall beside it). I'm going to save this info!
                    -- I'm Lamar -- Allen TC-4 Classic project, 1899 Kimball project
                    -- 5 melodicas, Rodgers W5000, RD300NX, Juno DS-61/88, FA-06 - Conn 643 - Hammond M3 - Hauptwerk
                    -- Public domain hymn search: https://songselect.ccli.com/search/r...t=publicdomain

                    Comment

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