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  • #1

    MIDI Hookups



    Greetings all,</P>


    Iwas wondering if there was someone out there that could give me some advice. I have a Johannus OPUS 10 that does nothave a sequencer. But I do have a Yamaha Clavinova digital piano that has a sequencer and according to the Yamaha manual the sequencerwill record and store from MIDI inputs. What I was hoping to do was record off the organ into theYamaha sequencer and then play back through the organ. Will that work?</P>


    The second dilemma I have is the Johannus MIDI connections are the typical headphone jacks, whereas the Yamaha has multi-pin connections. Is there a device that will couple the two different types of cabling?</P>


    My final question is whether or not it would bewiser just to by a digital recorder. If so, should I just record off the microphone or(so that I don't pick up stray noises) could I couple the Johannus midi multi pin connectionsto the recorder?</P>


    I would appreciate any advice that could be provided</P>


    Thanks in advance</P>


    Amateur Jerry</P>
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  • #2
    Re: MIDI Hookups



    Hi</p>

    Like many people, you seem to be mixing up MIDI and audio.</p>

    MIDI is just data, no sound. Audio is sound, no MIDI data.
    </p>

    1) I haven't got your manual but the Yamaha internal recorders don't normally record from external MIDI signals. They do output the MIDI data though. Do a double check on this.</p>

    2) MIDI uses standard 5-pin DIN connectors, as on the Clavinova. There is no other standard, and many makers buy 'off the peg' MIDI boards, so it seems very odd that the Johannus would use 1/4" jacks for MIDI. Are you sure there are no 5-pin DIN sockets there somewhere.
    </p>

    3) What do you want to do when recording? Just record a live performance for playback, or 'capture' it so you can then edit it/enhance it? If you just want to record the sounds, then MIDI isn't the way to go. All a MIDI recorder/sequencer will record is note on/off messages, plus stop change data, not the sounds. To hear the sounds, you'd then have to play the MIDI recording back on the instrument used for recording, ie. the piano's recorder would 'play' the Johannus. To record the sound, you need an audio recorder of some sort. You might be able to use the audio outputs on the Johannus. You cannot connect the MIDI outputs of the Johannus to an audio recorder. There are plenty of good digital audio recorders out there, I use a Boss BR600. If you've got multiple audio channels on the Johannus (ie more than 2) you'll also need a mixer. If you want to use mikes, that's a whole new ball game and you'll have to do some research about it. My BR600 has 2 good built-in mikes but I wouldn't use them for serious recordings.
    </p>

    Tell us exactly what you want to to and we'll be able to advise you further.</p>

    Andy
    </p>

    </p>

    </p>
    It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

    New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

    Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha Genos, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
    Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
    Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
    Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: MIDI Hookups



      Andy,</P>


      I want to be able to listen to what I played both as an instructional tool, and also to hear how the organ sounds (from a distance, you know how the organ sometimes sounds different listening to it vs playing it). Like the sequencer on the Clavinova, I would play a piece and then listen to the playback.</P>


      I previously tried using an analog tape recorder hookedup to theauxilliary output jacks, and therecording seemed to lack a lot of quality. When I do the same on the Clavinova (ie piano, harpsichord, or organ etc), it seems to sound fairly decent. (Many times I will record on the sequencer and when satisfied, I will just replay and record). I don't know if the fact that the Clavinova is a2 channel (L&amp;R) and the Johannus organ isa 4 channel output and auxilliary is only L&amp;R that some quality is lostinthe Johannushook up vs the Clavinova.</P>


      Suprisingly, I tookmyipod and placed it near the organ and recordedfora few minutes.I replayed the ipod through my USB into my computer (which has 5.1 surround sound) and it sounded quite good. The only thing was it did pick up a bumps and creaks as I was playing. That's why I was interested in the sequencer.</P>


      I am probably not that savvy yet to try and enhance, but basically I am looking to record for home use, and possiblydownload some of my work on a CD, or flashdrive, etc.</P>


      Thanks for your interest and help</P>


      Amateur Jerry</P>


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      Comment

      • #4
        Re: MIDI Hookups



        Depending on where you PC/laptop/Mac is in relation to your organ, and what audio card your computer has, you may be able to use it to do all you want. Audacity is a free to download audio programme that can give great results. With a suitable lead, you'd be able to take the 2 ch output and run it straight in to the line in on your computer. With a small mixer, you could take the 4 ch output and mix it to 2 channel for recording. </p>

        As far as MIDI recording goes, you'd first have to sort out the connections. This typically requires a USB to MIDI lead to connect between the computer and the organ. There is some free, and plenty of low-cost, software around that would let you record the MIDI from the organ, edit it if you want to take out the odd mistake etc, then play it back, while simultaneously recording the audio. You'd have the ability to overdub too of you want.</p>

        You might be able to do this for less than the cost of a good digital audio recorder. You do need a decent audio card for this. If you have a PC or Mac, then the M-Audio 2496 will do nicely and it's cheap. If you have a laptop, then you're looking at an external audio/MIDI interface. That will cost more. The software may be free!</p>

        Andy
        </p>

        </p>
        It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

        New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

        Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha Genos, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
        Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
        Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
        Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: MIDI Hookups



          Andy,</P>


          Thank you very much for the information. My office is a combination office &amp; music room. The organ and desk (with computer) are on opposite walls, but I could easily hook up to the USB ports onmycomputer with a 6' lead. (I often use my organ bench as a credenza behind my chair)I have a fairly high end Dell PC, but I have to check the sound card specs. I do like the idea of the mixer, especially after hearing the replay on the two channel analog recorder.</P>


          Maybe Santa's elves are making something for me now!</P>


          Have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year</P>


          Once again, thanks</P>


          Amateur Jerry</P>
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          Comment

          • #6
            Re: MIDI Hookups



            Even a high end Dell's sound card might not cut the mustard. Shell out on that 2496 I mentioned, even if you end up with 2 soundcards! It's an old design card, but tried tested and proven to give great results.</p>

            Andy
            </p>
            It's not what you play. It's not how you play. It's the fact that you're playing that counts.

            New website now live - www.andrew-gilbert.com

            Current instruments: Roland Atelier AT900 Platinum Edition, Yamaha Genos, Yamaha PSR-S970, Kawai K1m
            Retired Organs: Lots! Kawai SR6 x 2, Hammond L122, T402, T500 x 2, X5. Conn Martinique and 652. Gulbransen 2102 Pacemaker. Kimball Temptation.
            Retired Leslies, 147, 145 x 2, 760 x 2, 710, 415 x 2.
            Retired synths: Korg 700, Roland SH1000, Jen Superstringer, Kawai S100F, Kawai S100P, Kawai K1

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: MIDI Hookups

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              Andy,</P>


              I have been following your advice. I installed Audacity, and it worked (first time). I tried it off my Clavinova and off my Johannus. I was very impressed with thesound reproduction from the (free)software. The organ sounds betterfrom the computer than it does from the facade speakers! I even engaged Tutti andI didn't hear any distortion or loss of clarity.</P>


              I do have one problem and I have been wrestling with it, and it appears when I am recording from eitherthe Clavinova or the organ. The computer only plays/records sound on the left channel. The computer subwoofer picks up the base, but sound is only coming from the left channel. It appears that all the stereo is coming from that channel.</P>


              I don't believe it's Audacity. I checked my Line in settings and it shows balance in the middle. When I play either instrument from the Aux Out connections into the computer line in (even without recording) it's only reproduces one channel.</P>


              To verify that I am getting 2 channel sound from either instrument, I recorded aux out to an analog tape deck. The VMU bars on both channels showed input into the recorder. The only difference is that to record to the computer, I have to run both leads into a Y adapter, so I could hook the "one" lead into the computer Line In. To verify that I don't have a problem in the wire adapter, I hooked up a set of headphones to the Y adapter, and received both channels.</P>


              To verify I didn't have a problem in the output side of the computer, Iplayed a CD-no problem. I even recorded the organ through MIC Inon an ipod, and then downloaded through a USB-no problem. (Sound wasn't as good)</P>


              The signal graphics on the audacity indicate only one channel is receiving. </P>


              Do you know of anything that I am not checking that could solve this problem? Or, do I need an external sound card, etc? (Your help so farhas been much appreciated)</P>


              Also, on the discussion of Midi...Iordered an Audio Interface Device to hook-up my Din 5 connections on either instrument to the computer USB port. My question is, when I receive that device, am I ready for something like Hauptwerk, or is there other hardware/software that I will still need to buy?</P>
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              Once again thanks</P>


              Amateur Jerry</P>
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              Comment

              • #8
                Re: MIDI Hookups



                Check that you are using a stereo 'Y' adapter and not a Monaural one.</p>

                </p>

                </p>

                Randy
                </p>

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: MIDI Hookups



                  Randy,</P>


                  Thanks for the info... I never thought of that... </P>


                  I did have a little setback. I went to Radio Shack and picked one up. When I hooked it up, all I was getting was a loud hum and no recording sound through the computer. I was noticing the RCA plugs were real tight going into the adapter. I had an extra pair of the gold RCA cables from my surround sound system, and hooked those up and it worked. Sounds great.. Gonna have to learn some of the enhancement effects on the software.</P>


                  Nextproject to tackle is MIDI. I hope to learn enough about that to load Hauptwerk for the organ and one of the Virtual Piano (ie. Virtual Steinway, Synthogy etc) packages for the Clavinova.</P>


                  Regards</P>
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                  Amateur Jerry</P>

                  Comment

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