Help! Rodgers 340 Combination Action

[toodles]

You might try Matt Neill at MCN systems (http://www.mcnsystems.com/rodgers.htm)--he might have a complete combination action. Shipping on such a device would, of course, be expensive because of the size, and it would take a lot of effort to wire it in.

You might look into Artisan or other MIDI based combination action systems, and just replace the combination action with something modern--multiple memory levels, etc. (And no burn out if you hold a piston too long.) Still a lot of work and money, but if you go digital and still want moving stops you'd have the same expense.

[tucsondave]

If two of the transistors are good then you can still troubleshoot the system.
It's not likely that you can return semiconductors.
td

[Jeff Harbin]

Well, so far I have not had any luck tracking down a replacement 340 combination action.

I've gotten a quote on upgrading to Artisan. Parts and labor would cost me around $4K. I'm still reeling from the sticker shock! However, a full conversion would make sense due to the fact that I already own Hautpwerk VI and the Paramount 320 sample set.

I came across these products while searching online and am curious if they could replace the original Rodgers combination action:

http://www.petersonemp.com/products/pdf/Duoset.PDF

https://ssosystems.com/Sales_Lit/hiRes/CapLite.pdf

[Admin]

If you're going the VPO route, you don't need to worry about capture memory or number of memory levels. That functionality will be implemented by the VPO software. What you do need is a MIDI interface to your stop tabs and pistons that bypasses the broken factory system. I'm not familiar with Rodgers combination actions, so I can't be specific as to exactly what is required.

At a minimum, you'll need wires to the stop tab switches that go to a MIDI encoder to send messages to the VPO when stops are changed. You'll need a MIDI encoder to connected to the pistons to send messages when they are pressed. This should be very straight forward with off-the-shelf MIDI encoders. This will allow you to either use the VPO screen controls and combination system or to hand register from the console stops, but you'll run into problems if you try to do both in the same session. The physical stops selected on your console will not reflect the virtual stops selected by the VPOs combination action or screen controls and they'll be a conflict between the two.

To control the stops from both the organ and the VPO you'll need a MIDI interface that receives MIDI messages from stop changes on the VPO and actuates the stops on your console. Ideally, you'd be able to leverage the organ's existing capture action stop drivers and capture power supply. The trick will be figuring out how to do this. It would be easier to ditch the existing control circuitry, drivers, and capture supply and replace them with a suitable MIDI decoder and coil driver combination from a technical standpoint, but would likely require some serious re-wiring and an increased investment in components.

That said, both the units you referenced in your previous posts would be overkill for a VPO console, as they both have their own capture memories, something that is already implemented in the VPO software.

[Jeff Harbin]

Admin - thank you for taking the time to write all of that. I understand what you are saying. However, my initial intent was to only replace the combination action, not the analog voices, etc. which work perfectly fine. I had already invested a good bit of time and money into making the Rodgers work 100% when the combination action went out.

[Admin]

However, my initial intent was to only replace the combination action, not the analog voices, etc. which work perfectly fine. I had already invested a good bit of time and money into making the Rodgers work 100% when the combination action went out.

Ok, but you also wrote this, hence my response:

However, a full conversion would make sense due to the fact that I already own Hautpwerk VI and the Paramount 320 sample set.

Regardless of whether you to choose to use the console as VPO or not, if you have to replace the entire combination system, it would make sense to choose one that supports MIDI for future expansion. Neither the Petersen nor the Caplight system you referenced have that capability.

[Jeff Harbin]

Thank you for pointing that out. I actually already had the Hauptwerk software and Paramount sample set before the Rodgers 340 became available to me. I was using them with a mid-90's digital/MIDI compatible Rodgers that I was rebuilding for my church. I never dreamed that I would come to appreciate the analog sound and technology so much! Since everything works on the 340, it seems a shame to toss all of that in the dumpster.

[Admin]

I'd be surprised if it were not possible to repair the existing combination action. If I were troubleshooting your problem, I'd start by taking inventory as to exactly what is working and what is not. Based on your comments:

1. With the organ off, manually operate each stop tab and eliminate the possibility that the physical resistance you noticed on some of the tabs is mechanical. Note any stops that are out of the ordinary.
2. With the organ on, repeat the above step. Note any stops that are out of the ordinary. If there are any, is there a pattern, e.g. all the stops having resistance are in the Great division?
3. With the organ on, place all stops down, and press General Cancel. Note which stops don't switch off. Repeat. Is there a pattern?
4. With the organ on, place all stops down. Set a general piston for this. Turn all stops off, then press the general piston. Note which stops don't go down. Turn all stops off and repeat noting any inconsistencies with the previous result.
5. Repeat the previous two steps with a different general piston, and at least one piston from each division.
6. Collate your data. Which stops, pistons, or divisions fail? Under what circumstances? With consistancy?

Armed with this information, you can then target specific circuitry for specific problems. For example, if a stop fails to operate correctly with one piston, but works fine with another, that suggests a problem with combination memory. If a stop always turns on, but never turns off, that suggests a problem with that stop's driver or coil. Etc.

[plymouth53]

Jeff, If you decide to remove the memory circuit boards, I would like to have them. I have a Rodgers 333 that the mice ruined the memory boards and they are not repairable.
Also, as a note, the 333 used the silicon transistor 2N5879 instead of the germanium 2N1544. Don't know if they can be exchanged. The circuit designs are probably different.