651 Conn Pedal Problem

[Kathan]

I have a 651 Conn, which I love and unfortunatly I don't do repairs as some of you do. It must be wonderful to know the ins and outs of organs. I wish I was so gifted.</P>


When I play the C scale from middle C it plays just fine but if I go half steps, especially if I play E flat then F all the rest of the keys to upper C play the same note or tone. Sometimes it will play the right note but the background noise will be the same note. Sometimes if I hold the pedal down it will revert to the correct tone.</P>


One serviceman told me he knew what was wrong with it but he would have to have another person with him to turn the organ over to get at the bottom. Another serviceman who is the Conn and Allen authorized repairman said he didn't now what was wrong but avoid the e flat to F( which isimpossible, for me anyway) I am alittleweary about the first service man, so I don't what to do about it. </P>

[Guest]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem

Is this an organ that is normally able to play more than one pedal note at a time?  Some of the Conns are only designed for one note at a time pedal playing and the organ will not produce additional pedal notes while one pedal is already playing.  I wonder if there could be a sticking contact around e flat or F that remains closed after the key is released thus hampering the activation of the next note.  If so, this may indeed call for accessing the bottom of the organ where the contacts are.  

[Kathan]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem

Yes, you can play more than one pedal at a time.

[Kathan]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem



I removed the pedalboard and when I pressed the metal contacts they did not stick and always played the correct note with no other tone sounding.</P>


I don't recall exactly when the pedals started holding onto the extra sounds. A few years ago I replaced some broken black plastic pieces ( I don't remember what they were called but they have springs on each side) because they were all breaking. RecentlyI had the pedalboard refelted thinking that it would help, but it didn't. Could the spacing of the contacts on the pedal board be the culprit. </P>


When I replaced the black plastic pieces there were no screws on the ends like the originals and the repairman commented on it but the parts list I recieved when I ordered them said " there are no screws on the new parts as they are not needed." Anyone know why they had them there in the first place? </P>


Is turning the organ over the only way to get at the pedal contacts? I noticed at church they remove the back of the organ so I was wondering if there is something to remove so we did not have to turn it over. </P>

[geoelectro]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem



Since they work with the pedalboard off, you likely have some adjustment problems with the pedalboard. Some pedals have some kind of adjustment at the point where they contact the organ so look there. Also, the metal tabs you pushed can be slightly bent to make an adjustment.</p>

If the pedals are slightly pressing on a contact it may not fully shut off allowing that note to sound when other pedals are pressed. You could also test this by propping up the pedals where they meet the organ to raise the assembly up slightly. This may allow for full release.</p>

You can discover a pedal that's causing this by pressing each one by hand. The pedal should move down some before making a sound. A pedal that sounds as soon as it's pressed is suspect.</p>

George
</p>

[Kathan]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem

Thanks alot for the advice. I tried to prop up the pedal board ( but I probably didn't do it in the right place) and that didn't work but then I noticed the steel peg protruding out each side of the organ that thepedal boardrests on and theplastic covers (kinda of hard foam sheath) was pretty damaged and sunk in.I took about 12 inches of electrical tape and wrapped it around thepegs and foam sheaths and the pedalsnow play great. It is such ajoy to play the organagain with the pedals in tune.There's nothing like electrical tape and duct tape. The wonder working products. That's the cheapest solution I ever had.

[Guest]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem



I have a 651 that had the same problem. It plays only 1 note at a time per octave for the 16' for the lower 2 octaves, the 8' tibia is from the regular tibia and has a separate set of contacts, and the top octave is hacked from the tibia. (I have the schematic if you need it)
</p>

I replaced every plastic pedal lever holder and then had your problem. I was able to solve it with a little work. I guess my big mistake was assuming all of the pedal levers were in a straight line - which they are not - as it all depends on how the contacts are installed inside the console (i.e. the curved/angled lever in the console that these levers press down).
</p>

Now, if notes above a note play the same note, that means the pedal contact "pusher" on the pedal board is too low. I found this out when I replaced all of the "contact levers" on the pedal board side. If a contact lever is too low, notes below will be OK but notes above will play that note. The solution is easy but time consuming. Pull the pedal board back from the console and raise the metal "L" shaped push lever on that pedal up a little. Replace pedal board and test. Repeat until all are adjusted correctly.
</p>

Another important thing to remember the pedal board locks to the console with a heavy metal "lever" or "finger" on each end of the pedal board. The console has a metal pin that this sits on and sort of locks to to prevent the pedal board from pulling out. However, those metal pins had a piece of rubber tubing on them (about 3/32" thick) which RAISES the pedal board by that amount. If these are missing or slipped out of place (glue them in place as the slip off all the time) you can either put them back on OR adjust every pedal lever UP by about 3/32". Another option is to put shims under the console side of the pedal board to raise it up. </p>

All those pedal metal levers on the pedal board are not necessarily in a straight line, either.
</p>

[Kathan]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem



Hi Thank you for the suggstions. I will try them as soon as I can. I'm glad I did not pay for that service man to turn my organ over as I can see so well when I just tried the contacts that they work fine. I hate throwing money away. I thought the tape was working until the problem started again as soomn as the hitch wore into the tape. </P>


Also one day I just took the pedal board off and stood it up and noticed that the board across and under the pedals( it is probably just a brace)the bottom, is bowed out in the middle directly under the e flat-e -anf f area.If I put a shim under that area the rest of the pedals are too high to make contact.I was thinking of having my husband put a new board across there. If the board issagging so maybe the pedals are sagging also and that is why the note is hanging on. On the side of simplicity tho I think I will try your suggestin of adjusting the metal levers first.</P>

[Kathan]

Re: 651 Conn Pedal Problem



Thank you to all you who responded to my pedal plight. When I first tried to adjust the pedal parts I adjusted them sideways because I thought they were touching each other. Now I adjusted them up and it took care of the problem . Of couse it took awhile and then other pedal parts would start sounding bad and need moving up but it is working fine and did't revert back like the tape deal. Thanks again</P>


Now if the Allen 603 I play at chuch could be fixed that easily, I would really be happy. I think a power surge went through while playing hymns ona Sunday morning and I don't know if the power supply was hit or the mother board and some of the smaller boards. I asked my pastor to ask the insurance co to see if we have surge insurance but they don't think it was so they won't even call. The Allen serviceman cut the channels down to two so I'm playing on 50 % of the organ and the lower manuel is not really playable.</P>