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If I invented my own organ.

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    If I invented my own organ.

    Furniture
    Last edited by Eddy67716; 08-05-2017, 03:05 AM. Reason: To add a cornopeon 8 stop

    #2
    You might consider having the Solo Concert Oboe 8 also play at 4' on the Pedal Division.

    Comment


      #3
      You're going to need a bigger house. I might consider a 16' Posaune in the Swell instead of the Double Trompette.

      flashguy

      Comment


        #4
        Bigger house? Bigger Cathedral maybe. That thing isn't fitting into anything less than a full on Town Hall or the equivalent. And I wouldn't want to guess at the cost. Millions at least in 2017 dollars. So it is a fantasy instrument through and through. And why not. It's fun to dream. So my first quibble, since this is a money no object fantasy design... why hold back and make the 32' stops 'optional'?? They most certainly are not, given the amount of upper pitches in this specification! Plenum tone is like a big tree. The bigger it is the more of a root system it needs to keep from toppling over. A 32' resultant or stopped rank simply won't be sufficient to undergird a hundred ranks of upperwork. Also the notion of 'room'... room for pipes? In 2017 it simply cannot be sustained, the notion of uber sized organs totally or even partially of pipe construction. All that lead... simply unsustainable. This would have to be a digital or VPO.

        The manual divisions need gravitas but I don't know if the Great needs both a 16' Diapason and a 16' Bourdon. I would consider a 16' Violone and a 5-1/3' ________ as sufficient harmonic reinforcement for the Great upperwork. I would have appreciated seeing a clear separation between the Choir and Positiv even if they share the same manual. I think a fifth manual would be very useful to house the big reeds. Then all those disparate 8' stops on the Great could be migrated to the Solo division. As it stands they would simply get in each others way. Also all those sub, super and unison off couplers become almost totally redundant on an organ this size. There is no need to go through the mental and physical exercise of coupling a stop an octave lower and disabling its unison to get its needed tonal contribution when a stop of the right pitch and tone color already exists on that manual.

        The monster specifications that we all browse from time to time do not exist simply as wish lists of organ tone. There (should be) is a sound tonal architecture that has been planned out by the builder to achieve a desired end. Simply laying in every kind of pipe construction that can be thought of won't make for an organ that can actually be enjoyed by listeners or registered effectively by the organist(s). And while I am on a total tear through this labor of love by the o.p. I might as well go all the way, there should probably be an Antiphonal Division on an organ this size. Tubas or Trumpets and their harmonic reinforcements at least, if not a complete Principal Chorus and flues with mixture(s). That's all I've got. This is all meant to be constructive criticism. Honest.

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          #5
          I'd have a Fanfare trumpet of some sort as well as the tubas.

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            #6
            Something that big would probably need both a Fanfare Trumpet (Trompette en Chamade) and a horizontal Tuba.

            I counted about 125 ranks--not truly enormous, but very large. This would be an instrument that cost at least $4,000,000 and more likely more than $5,000,000--a top builder might charge more than $6,000,000 for it. (The $4,000,000 figure is based on a rule-of-thumb cost of about $35,000/rank, which was pretty common back in the early 2000s. The organ price does not include costs of the building or modifications to one.

            David

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              #7
              Rather boring with all those similar sounding 16', 8' and 4', don't you think? Not much really standing out of it. Large, but a large dose of mud.

              Comment


                #8
                Furniture
                Last edited by Eddy67716; 08-06-2017, 06:51 PM. Reason: Compacting the list

                Comment


                  #9
                  I've moved this thread to the Organ Specifications area. Please read the sticky on Forum policy regarding the posting of specifications of organs that do not exist.
                  http://www.organforum.com/forums/sho...l=1#post142221

                  Technically, I believe this specification is in violation of that policy, but I'll let it stand for now; however, future specifications of this nature, in or out of this thread, will be removed.
                  -Admin

                  Allen 965
                  Zuma Group Midi Keyboard Encoder
                  Zuma Group DM Midi Stop Controller
                  Hauptwerk 4.2

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Havoc View Post
                    Rather boring with all those similar sounding 16', 8' and 4', don't you think? Not much really standing out of it. Large, but a large dose of mud.
                    Surely there aren't that may 16 foot stops to make it that muddy?

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Eddy67716, I like the idea behind a floating string division. I think I would add a floating reed division with several interesting solo/ensemble reeds and some nice reed choruses that could be coupled to the Great with a Melody Coupler or coupled at 16' (for convenience) or 8' to any division.

                      Also, I don't think Havoc was referring to pitch muddiness. I always want more 16' and 32' stop options. I think Havoc was referring to the redundancy of having so many similar stops in several divisions plus sub, unison, and super couplers. With a large enough stoplist the only necessary couplers would be the standard (unison/8') inter-division couplers. Why couple 8' stops to another division at 4' (or 16') when there are several adequate 4' (or 16') stops available on either division?

                      Admin, would it be better to insert a photo (or link to a file) of a large stoplist so that it doesn't take up so much post space? or is a table a better option? I've been considering posting stoplist ideas for a virtual organ I'm planning on creating in the near future.
                      Sam
                      Home: Allen ADC-4500 Church: Allen MDS-5
                      Files: Allen Tone Card (TC) Database, TC Info, TC Converter, TC Mixer, ADC TC SF2, and MOS TC SF2, ADC TC Cad/Rvt, MOS TC Cad/Rvt, Organ Database, Music Library, etc. PM for unlinked files.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by samibe View Post
                        Admin, would it be better to insert a photo (or link to a file) of a large stoplist so that it doesn't take up so much post space? or is a table a better option? I've been considering posting stoplist ideas for a virtual organ I'm planning on creating in the near future.
                        Yes, the amount of page real estate these large stop lists take up is one of the reasons they're frowned upon. Using a table to implement multiple columns would help. Go Advanced to edit your message and if you're using the Enhanced Interface - Full WYSIWYG editor (see your General Settings) there is a table option in the tool bar. Or, you can use BBCode to implement your own table.

                        But the main problem I, and others, have with these fantasy organ specs is that they often wind up being just a huge list of stops randomly copied from a stop dictionary, with no concept of tonal design or practicality. If you browse some of the older threads from ten years back in this Forum you can see exactly where this leads.

                        I don't have a problem with posting stop lists of large organs- pipe or digital- that have been built or are being built. That's useful, especially if there are recordings of the instrument. So, if you're planning a posting a stop list of a VPO that you're designing, please use the posting guidelines specified, or, if its size falls outside those guidelines, wait until you have implemented it and can post sound samples.
                        Last edited by Admin; 08-08-2017, 07:20 AM.
                        -Admin

                        Allen 965
                        Zuma Group Midi Keyboard Encoder
                        Zuma Group DM Midi Stop Controller
                        Hauptwerk 4.2

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I'd like to have lots of couplers and redundant stops of the same or slightly different volume and timbre. You can make sounds that you just can't quite get as easily by using stops only instead of couplers, and that you can't get with only few of a certain kind of stop. Also refundant stops could use pipes in different locations for getting the desired sound movement effect: left, right, up, down or random sound movement according to the note played. I'm certainly not against a lot of manuals too for the sake of making things easier for a one man show, or even a duet. With the possibility of playing 2 manuals with each hand, and not having time to use pistons, extra can be helpful.

                          I come from the (pipe organ is a mechanical synthesizer) point of view, so I want to be able to get any sound effect from real mechanics and not micro computer technology that is impossible to easily hand craft let alone hand craft at all. Not that it needs to be hand crafted, but you can't just go make your own computer without lots of resources that far exceed what is required to make sounds mechanically. You can quickly get sounds from hand crafting while digital sounds will come faster, but after a long time of no results and just a bunch of building the equipment required to make and program microchips.
                          Allen 530A

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                            #14
                            Is it okay to add non existing stoplists like this?
                            Ed's organ stoplist.pdf

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I have edited it.

                              Are PDF stoplists of non-existing organs like this even allowed? (I thought they would be because they don't take up the whole screen on the website.)
                              Ed's organ stoplist.pdf

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