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  • VPO/Computer

    Is it possible to control 2 Grandorgue VPO's on 2 separate computers using midi thru? Example: I have a sample set that requires minimum 32 GB ram but have 2 dell i5's each with 1 TB hard drive and 16 GB Ram. Can I install GrandOrgue on both i5's, each with its own audio/midi interface then install half of the sample sets on one computer and half on the other computer?

    Midi out from my console to midi in on computer 1 then
    midi out from computer 1 to midi in on computer 2

    Is this set up a possibility?

    Thanks, William

  • #2
    Haven't tried anything like that, but from my understanding of MIDI, you can certainly daisy-chain MIDI tone generators of any kind. But the correct wiring would be:
    MIDI out of the console ---> MIDI in of the first computer
    MIDI THRU of the first computer ---> MIDI in of the second computer.

    MIDI "thru" is an exact copy of the incoming MIDI stream received. But MIDI "out" is not. So your Computer #1 will have to have a MIDI THRU jack for this to work. A standard USB-MIDI adapter probably doesn't have this, but there are bound to be some that do.

    Alternatively, you can buy little black boxes called "MIDI THRU" boxes that receive a single incoming MIDI signal and output it unchanged on two or more separate jacks, thus "multiplying" the number of external devices or computers you can attach. That would certainly work in your case.
    *** Please post your questions about technical service or repair matters ON THE FORUM. Do not send your questions to me or another member by private message. Information shared is for the benefit of the entire organ community, but other folks will not be helped by information we exchange in private messages!


    • #3
      The only way I could see your idea working from a MIDI perspective (leaving the software functionality out of the equation for now) is if you were able to isolate various parts of the sample sets to specific MIDI channels and run the MIDI out of your console to a MIDI Thru box (see link below). Then from there go to both laptops, each responding only to whatever MIDI channels their samples are assigned to.

      That being said - I am not sure the sample sets are mapped out that way. Your best bet, IMO, is either to get more RAM for one of the laptops, or if that is not an option, to sell both and get a laptop that can handle the situation!
      1st born: 1958 B3 & 1964 Leslie 122
      Most Proud of: 1938 Concert Model E paired w/ 1948 Leslie 31A & Vibratone (Leslie) 30A (c.1942)
      Daily Workhorse: 3 Manual Rodgers running Hauptwerk 4.2
      New Kid on the Block: Hammond Novachord (year not determined yet)


      • #4
        Either jbird604 or JoeyB3 solution will work as far as MIDI routing goes; however, channel assignment will be by division and function, not sample. Although on classical organs, the sample may belong exclusively to one division, and therefore effectively to one channel, that would not hold true for theatre organs or other organs with unification. The other problem with splitting between computers is likely to be couplers. Also, assuming you can at all that worked, you'll still have to set up your combinations on both machines.

        As JoeyB3 says, you're better off adding RAM or getting a computer that has the capability you're looking for, although a laptop with 32GB is probably going to be pricey.

        Allen 965
        Zuma Group Midi Keyboard Encoder
        Zuma Group DM Midi Stop Controller
        Hauptwerk 4.2


        • #5
          In this situation, I would try something different:

          Install a MIDI over IP tunnel software on both PCs (Goolge is your friend) and create a (virtual) MIDI connection from the master, first PC to the second, slave PC. I would not use a physical classic MIDI cable, because it is has a quite limited bandwidth.

          On the slave PC start GO and load a sampleset - you will probably need to adjust the load settings to load just a part of the organ and configure the audio output. Don't do any MIDI configuration, just make sure, that GO sees the (virtual) MIDI connection as MIDI input.

          On the master PC, start GO and enable the (virtual) MIDI connection as MIDI output in the GO settings and select this connection in the "send MIDI recorder output" option.
          Load the SAME sampleset in the master GO and just connect/assign the MIDI input on the master GO. If the master GO is started after the slave GO is ready, it will mirror all stop/coupler/manual/... action automatically.

          Any tuning/intonation related changes are not mirrored - You need to adjust both GOs seperatly.


          • #6
            I certainly don't know this for certain, but it seems to me that any other solution except: a more capable computer (whatever that entails) is going to increase the dreaded, the feared, the loathed ... latency. The idea is strangely intriguing nonetheless. Perhaps not to allow a large organ to reside across two laptops worth of resources but perhaps to marry two disimilar instruments, say a theater instrument 'married' to a classic one or a theater (or classic!) instrument married to a dedicated percussion/orchestral textures 'organ'. Keep us posted.


            • #7
              It is possible to do this. I think the easiest way will be to run the two modified versions of GO, one on each computer, using ipmid installed on both computers. Then create a jOrgan front end on the 'main' computer to which you will be connecting your midi equipment. Let jOrgan do all the pistons, memories as well as all the couplers. It should work perfectly. I have sucesfully run jOrgan using fluidsynth on two Raspberry Pi 3's, with my midi equipment connected only to the 'master' Pi. I then had audio equipment connected to both Pi's. There was no noticeable latency issues on the 'slave' Pi.


              • #8
                Using ipmidi [or any similar tool] as virtual MIDI connection + 2 GOs connected via it using the "MIDI recorder output" option is easier than creating a jorgan frontends and running jorgan additionally.
                If both GO load the SAME sampleset, the master GO will control the slave GO automatically. The master GO is used normally by the user (eg. MIDI assignment) - the slave GO has not MIDI assignments.

                PS: If somebody wants to use multiple samplesets concurrently, use the GO "-i" parameter - each instance has a distinct configuration.


                • #9
                  Hi William,

                  Maybe I am already late with the answer to your initial post, but you may take a look on the solution presented here:

                  As I have understood, the device has parallel MIDI outputs, assigned to different divisions. You may check it with the developer. The outputs are synchronized. It will reduce latency (but will not eliminate it completely).

                  Good luck!


                  • #10
                    You control the couplers on the external box, a part of the stops on computer 1 and the rest on computer 2. And you need to use two combinations concurrently systems not being able to control couplers and each being limited to a subset of the stops.

                    I would be really interested in the price of that box and how it compares to additional 16GB memory for just one computer (80-140€).