How To Learn To Repair Pipe Organs

[Carson Lanning]

So I am only 15 but I love organs. My church has the largest organ in my state but it is no longer used. It is not going anywhere and I would say it's at about 70% and a little out of tune. When I become an adult I want to help fix it. I was just wondering what resources or people I can learn from and how much it could potentially cost. The organ is opus 2619 Austin organs at north Phoenix baptist church.

[Carson Lanning]

[Larason2]

Welcome to the forum! Learning to repair organs is a very rewarding hobby, but it can take quite some time to get good at it! The ideal would be to find a pipe organ builder and apprentice with them. Before doing that, it would be helpful to get some experience in woodworking or another related field. If that's not possible for some reason, it's a good idea to read up on pipe organ history and building as much as possible. If there are any reed organs that need repairing in your area, picking up one and rebuilding it is a good way to start building skills.

[Coenraads]

Get to know the organ-builder/technician who tunes pipe organs in your area. They are always looking for someone to hold keys while they are tuning. You'll learn a lot about how a pipe organ is tuned by helping out in this way. This you can do at your age even with little knowledge and training but do read up on temperaments, and the physics of tuning (beats, the twelfth root of two, etc.). As a reward the tuner may teach you the rudiments of tuning flue pipes and later on he or she may even let you try your hand at reed pipes. It's the best place to begin.

[Coenraads]

An afterthought:
Do download the following apps and learn how to use them.
iStrobeSoft-HD
Cleartune
PanoTuner
PitchLab (the best of the bunch)

A nother brilliant ly done app very pertinent to pipe organs.
SpectrumView (the spectrum analyzer is useful when voicing pipes letting you compare the harmonic structure of adjacent pipes with the one you are voicing)

Some time in the past, I and the local organ builder did a presentation on organ tuning for organists.
I photographed my flip-chart pages and they will at least outline the basics of what you need to learn.

https://sites.google.com/site/casava...g-101-part-a-1

The organ builder gave this handout with some ideas you may find useful:

https://sites.google.com/site/casava...ing-101-part-b

Good luck with your endeavours.

[michaelhoddy]

Wow, Carson, that is a substantial organ!

https://pipeorgandatabase.org/organ/13810

For the rest of you, this is a 1979 92-rank Austin on 4 manuals, from one of the golden ages of their work. A shame it's not used any longer. A waste, really.

One of the biggest principles of good organ work is "do no harm." Meaning, appreciate the organ for what it is, even if there are faults, it's out of tune, or there's things that need repair, but don't get in over your head if you don't have the training or experience to do any tuning or attempted repairs correctly. More than a few fine pipe organs have been permanently damaged by well-intentioned folks without the proper understanding and background. In other words, don't let your heart and hands get ahead of your head.

I agree that the best way to begin at your age is to volunteer to an organ tuner or repair firm. They might from there bring you on as part-time shop help if things go well, but every step of the way, you're observing and learning new skills.

[Admin]

Welcome to the Forum. As michaelhoddy suggests, apprenticing yourself to a local pipe organ technician would be beneficial. I'd also recommend becoming involved with local AGO and ATOS groups. The Valley of the Sun Chapter of the ATOS owns and maintains the 30 rank Wurlitzer Theatre Pipe Organ in the Phoenix Orpheum theatre and several of its members have pipe organs in their homes and welcome members to play and work on them.

The circumstances regarding the North Phoenix Baptist Austin are unfortunate. The organ was dedicated by Virgil Fox in November 1978 and within several years was no longer used its function being replaced by praise bands. Allegedly, the church has a recording of the entire concert (see below), but has not made it available.

My understanding is that screens now block the chambers and pipe facades and the console is locked away.

Before

After Remodel

Reportedly, inquiries regarding the organ are politely, but firmly rebuffed. A trusted and reliable source posted on Facebook that two of his friends visited the church a couple of years ago and asked if it were possible to view the organ. They were politely shown the door and told not to come back.

I think everyone in the Arizona organ community would welcome a return of this magnificent instrument. Perhaps your curiosity and enthusiasm will awaken church leaders to this wonderful and valuable musical resource. Best of luck!

Here's a link to the first half of the Fox dedication concert.

[myorgan]

In looking at the two photos, it looks almost like the pipe façade spaces were blocked off with acoustically transparent cloth of some sort. I wonder if the projection screens are acoustically transparent as well?

It's really too bad about the treatment of guests who inquire about the organ. What a shame to marginalize such a large and potentially useful instrument!

Michael

[michaelhoddy]

Love him or hate him, and I know there's a wide mix of opinion just like there is with Cameron Carpenter, it's really interesting to hear Virgil at this late stage of his life- he would die less than two years from the date of this concert. You hear flashes of that Fox brilliance, but also some stumbles and misses. A very interesting listen.

[Admin]

RE: Virgil Fox. There's no doubting the influence he had on the organ world during his life. Watching the video above I was impressed once again by his ability to establish rapport with his audience and convey his obvious passion for the music he performs. I try keep an open mind about musical interpretation and am more focused on whether the performance makes musical sense to me or not rather than the historical correctness - the reason for most of the Fox controversy.

The church acoustics were reportedly dead back then, and even more dead after the remodeling. That certainly did not help his performance style and the compressed audio of the recording doesn't help either, but he was clearly not at the top of his game here.

[AllenAnalog]

Sometimes I am beyond dumbfounded at what people who call themselves Christians will do. This may be a Baptist church but it sounds more like some charismatic leader has taken over and the sheep are following in lock step.

If they didn't want to maintain the organ for their own use and refuse to let others play it for fear members of the congregation might hear it and want it brought back for a traditional service, they should have worked with a group like the Organ Clearing House to find a new home for it.

Back when they stopped using it there were still churches looking for pipe organs who could not afford a new one. They could have performed a major charitable act by giving it away to a worthy church or school.

Hiding it behind a facade and locking away the console is beyond shameful in my opinion. I have no respect at all for folks like this.

[Admin]

The "after" picture above shows the console still on stage. I don't know the photo's date. Perhaps Carson Lanning can let us know if that's still the case. What I find strange is fact that they covered the pipe facade. Whether it's acoustically transparent or not speaks to the likelihood of the organ being played again, but I don't understand the decision to hide it. It's almost as if having the largest pipe organ in the state is regarded as an embarrassment. I think you're right. Hiding it away lessens potential questions as to why it isn't being used.

[gtc]

Reportedly, inquiries regarding the organ are politely, but firmly rebuffed. A trusted and reliable source posted on Facebook that two of his friends visited the church a couple of years ago and asked if it were possible to view the organ. They were politely shown the door and told not to come back.

Now there's an organization that needs a change of leadership, if ever there was one.

[gtc]

It's great to see a youngster interested in the King of Instruments.

In addition to all of the good advice above, you can find quite a lot of videos on YouTube on the building and repairing of pipe organs.

Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2jxgvcGjfo

[sandstone42]

So I am only 15 but I love organs. My church has the largest organ in my state but it is no longer used.

I don't want to discourage you but, being in a Baptist church myself, you are fighting years of "contemporary christian," banal music styling. If the pastor and Music Ministry are behind the praise band then you are pretty much out of luck. My own home VPO was a necessity for my own sanity. Unless you have a significant group of other young, like-minded individuals as yourself I think you will be "bashing your head against a brick wall." But then again, I have been often called an "old curmudgeon" recently.

[gtc]

I don't want to discourage you but, being in a Baptist church myself, you are fighting years of "contemporary christian," banal music styling. If the pastor and Music Ministry are behind the praise band then you are pretty much out of luck.

Yes, don't be disheartened by the apparent complete disregard by the current 'leadership' for that wonderful, criminally walled-in instrument. Look elsewhere for opportunities to work on and around pipe organs that people still want.

[myorgan]

One can find the church's website here: https://www.nphx.org. There's no mention of a music or worship minister or program. Evidently, that's not their focus any more. Is there a college near there? That appears to be their new focus.

Michael

[sandstone42]

The website shows a WORSHIP & CREATIVE team under the page on Our Team. The team will likely believe that the college students want "contemporary Christian" music. I'll also hazard a guess that not one of them has a music degree.

[Admin]

Is there a college near there? That appears to be their new focus.

The main campus of ASU is about 15 miles away and Grand Canyon University, a Christian school, about 5, but good luck sustaining an operation of that scale with a congregation of penniless college kids if that is the intent.

[gtc]

One can find the church's website here: https://www.nphx.org. There's no mention of a music or worship minister or program.

I think this says it all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf99H2zjAuo

[myorgan]

What will they think of next-Salvation via text? It was 25 minutes of commercial followed by 25 minutes of a powerpoint presentation. I've always avoided churches with "shows."

Michael

[AllenAnalog]

That video plus the second photo posted by Admin says it all. This church is geared to very high TV production values like many megachurches. Look at the two high tech consoles and the two professional grade TV cameras flanking that director's desk. To me it's religious entertainment, not a worship service engaging the congregation.

I saw that starting in the late 1980s when we sold our first theatrical lighting system to a church. When I got a copy of the architect's plans I thought I was looking at a new theater, not a church. Then I read the title block and saw it was a "community church" with an enormous budget.