Piezo microphone for accordion??

[Guest]

Hello everyone, im sure you've looked in to this already once or twice, did anyone ever tried to install piezo microphone in a accordion?? Did it worked for you

[KC9UDX]

I can't say that I have any experience installing microphones in an accordion. But I've looked at a few kits and this one looks less impressive than any others I've seen. I know that doesn't mean much though, so maybe it works okay.

[samibe]

I bought a few piezos a few years ago to make a pickup for my classical guitar. I used double sided tape that wouldn't damage my guitar's soundboard finish to attach the piezo to the soundboard. I experimented with different placements until I was accurately reproducing the sound of my guitar through the amp. The key with a piezo, is that it needs to be in contact with something that vibrates. It's not a very good microphone (in contact with only air). I'm not sure where it could be attached to an accordion to produce a good signal.

[andijah]

I haven't installed any pickups in my instruments. In small to medium-sized churches I use the accordion "as it is" and in other cases we've simply used one or two microphones that we put in front of the instrument (one to pick up treble, the other to pick up bass; or one in the middle).

[DaveADC6500]

Tony, Samibe is right. They're not so great unless you have them on something that vibrates. There sure isn't much of that for accordions.
They're reeds. Works great on piano sound board and noninvasive to the instrument. Like I just told others the other day, when I was a kid I had the same setup you show here with microphones. There were 2 on bass and 2 on keyboard side. Had that for years and just plug it into anyone's amplifier on the job with standard 1/4 in jack.

The only problem with it was ** 'you had to remember to not speak' ** as it would come out of the speakers. That can be greatly mitigated by keeping the bellows closed when on stage and yelling over to the guitarist 'Hey, let's play this one for them'.

We really never had a problem . NEVER had feedback. I've never forgot how the microphones changed the way I felt about my accordion.
Dave

[DaveADC6500]

All this talk about these great accordions got me going. I went to a friend's home who has several accordions. I told him about the microphone thread here and so we opened up the one he has mic's in where we just disconnected one bellows side. and there they were. just 2 of them and we couldn't read anything on them. We plugged it in to an amp and talked to the mic and it worked fine. He was saying that years back they said the microphone had good wide range since it was always in close to the sounds, as 1 was fixed on the bass side and the other on the the piano side. They were just on 2 little hand-made wire brackets screwed down to the body.

If you can believe it, there was only 1 knob for volume for both sides.

He dug out one (accordion) that was very old but looked like a beauty. He said it doesn't work very dependably now. We both thought we would take the pins out and pull of the piano side. The was lots of stuff to see and marvel over but we thought we saw wax. Wax?

Was this really wax or decomposed adhesives they used then?
We didn't disturb any, but if this is really wax, wouldn't things move around when it was warm? That doesn't sound like a good idea. I would have thought that a good wood glue would be great for the job.
Is it really wax and do they still do it today?
Dave

[KC9UDX]

Hmm... I thought waxed construction was the norm. I thought only certain models from Hohner were constructed without. But I've probably never worked on or even seen the gubbins of one made in the last fifty years.

The wax is actually called "accordion wax" or "reed wax". It was (obviously) developed specifically for the accordion, but has other uses. It's a mixture of beeswax, rosin, and flaxseed oil. (Don't quote me on this, my memory is not that reliable).

Things do move around with temperature. Think what would happen to all those separate parts if they didn't.

The alternative to wax is felt or rubber which necessitates a much different construction, and is usually much heavier. Again don't quote me but I seem to recall that you just won't find a multiple-register accordion that isn't waxed.

Wood glue would be very problematic. First, I expect the reeds to distort with temperature changes (and this isn't to be taken lightly), and repairs would be virtually impossible.

It is important not to leave an accordion in your car in the summer, for example. Reeds do fall out at times. Usually the consequence is a lack of bellows pressure with certain notes which will have missing tones. It's possible for a loose reed not only to get damaged, but also for the loose reed to damage the accordion (think cut bellows). Fortunately, I think reeds don't usually come all the way off during a performance. Usually one side will get a crack in the wax, causing the same symptom, but not damage.

[DaveADC6500]

Hey man, thanks for the info.
You're right I'm sure you remember correctly. I didn't know about an 'norm', where as I thought it was just some old bad glue job.
When I had mine I was just a young kid. I didn't know about any 'innards'. I had no idea that wax was used until I saw your reply. Great info on the variations.
Well, that does answer a few questions about their stability. This weekend I'll tell my friend about his old one and that it's wax in there.
Interesting about the weight.

Hey KC9UDX, I saw you videos !! Great stuff. Some day soon I'll have to learn how to make a video.
Yes, that's quite a collection.
I would 'like you' but don't know how and anyway I don't know if I'm allowed cause I just joined.
Thanks for your reply.
Dave

[KC9UDX]

You're quite welcome.

Something to note about old accordions: As the wax ages, it hardens, becomes brittle, cracks, leaks, etc. But all that needs to be done is to reheat the wax. I use a clean soldering iron. I have extra wax (purchased from Ernest Deffner) because sometimes I need to add a little. The soldering iron doesn't leave it looking pretty, and if you ever have to take your accordion in for repairs, you might want to try to replicate the technique of professionals, else someone might not want to work on it. I don't know, I've never had the budget to let someone work on any of mine.

Weight is also the reason accordions have rust-prone steel reeds. Brass adds a lot of weight. Also I assume is why cellulose is still so popular for the casework. (Cellulose is used for almost nothing else these days, being replaced with heavier but less flammable plastics).

What you could do is subscribe to my YouTube channel. 😁
I don't make any money on YouTube, but having more subscribers makes YouTube obscure my content less.