hammond model M-116?

[fluid69]

I just got home from a 10 hour round trip to nashville, where I picked up my new, (to me), 1964 M-101. Its a one owner. I purchased it from the original owner that bought it new. Included with the organ was the original sales reciept, the maintainance



schedule, the reciept from her first payment on the installment plan, the hammond catalog from the Hammond Organ Studios in nashville that she wrote the prices in when she looked at the different models, as well as the warranty and registration certificate. The main thing that caught my eye, and should be visable in the pics, is the model # on the certicate from hammond, has the model listed as "M-116, and then blacked out and "M-101" stamped up above on both the inside and the outside. The serial # matches the plate on the organ, which is 27834. The serial number to me seems really low, but it has the AO-44 reverb amplifer instead of the AO-35. Ive never seen an M-116 before, and dont see it listed in hers or my hammond catalog. This organ was actually a display model. does anyone have any info on this? Did hammond have a misprint and used the certificates anyway? All input is welcome.

[picothinker]

Congrats on a good find. I'm not familiar with M-116, but Hammond used differing suffixes to denote different cabinet styles and finishes: M-102, M-111, M-143, etc. Post some more pics, perhaps those that know more can chime in.

You can compare yours to the serial number list at Tonewheel General.

[JonathanP]

Very nice original finds! I regret deeply not scanning and uploading the price list for the Hammond organs and Leslie speakers here in the UK, I had one late 60s, one early 70s and one earl 80s. My biggest regret, which was really stupid, is not uploading the Sharma brochures! They're extremely rare but every model of Sharma speaker (excluding the 7000 Jubilee) was listed in there, with all the specs side by side - that was a great find! The prices of those speakers were also on the price lists, an interesting comparison to the Leslies. As the 145s and 147s were seen as old, the Sharma speakers actually cost more than the 145 and 147 after the 710 and 760/770 were released! I bet the people who didn't buy a 145/147 were kicking themselves later on!

Anyway, to the OP's attention: I think this may be a few months before its release, but in that booklet you don't have anything about the model M-162 and/or M-165, do you? I've seen advertising literature for every other Hammond M1-- model, but not the M-162 or M-165! If you have that, I'd be very interested in seeing it.

[fluid69]

Very nice original finds! I regret deeply not scanning and uploading the price list for the Hammond organs and Leslie speakers here in the UK, I had one late 60s, one early 70s and one earl 80s. My biggest regret, which was really stupid, is not uploading the Sharma brochures! They're extremely rare but every model of Sharma speaker (excluding the 7000 Jubilee) was listed in there, with all the specs side by side - that was a great find! The prices of those speakers were also on the price lists, an interesting comparison to the Leslies. As the 145s and 147s were seen as old, the Sharma speakers actually cost more than the 145 and 147 after the 710 and 760/770 were released! I bet the people who didn't buy a 145/147 were kicking themselves later on!

Anyway, to the OP's attention: I think this may be a few months before its release, but in that booklet you don't have anything about the model M-162 and/or M-165, do you? I've seen advertising literature for every other Hammond M1-- model, but not the M-162 or M-165! If you have that, I'd be very interested in seeing it.

I also forgot to mention the plate on the back of the organ actually does say M-101, as well as, the documentaion included a book on just the harmonic drawbars and the Hammond model M-100 serieis owners playing guide. The harmonic drawbars book appears to be a piece of sells litature that goes into great detail to explain why their drawbar system is far superiour to other makes presets. The owners playing guide has drawbar settings, (with vibrato and chorus settings), for many different instruments and styles of music, and even sheet music to several songs.

Her hammond catalog only had pictures and descriptions of the m-101, m-102, & m-103. In my pdf catalog it has the m-162 & m-165 listed. The style is listed as institutional, the finish as walnut and oak, production dates of Feb '65 to Jan '68, and prices of $1,660.00 & $1,710.00. Some interesting things I noticed between our two catalogs: in hers she wrote down the prices of the L & m seriesfrom the dealership, (those were the two models she was interested in because of the reverb), her price for the L-122 was $1,075 & she actually paid $1615.00 for her M-101. My catalog has the price for the L-122 $1,175 & the M-101 as $1,495.

[JonathanP]

I also forgot to mention the plate on the back of the organ actually does say M-101, as well as, the documentaion included a book on just the harmonic drawbars and the Hammond model M-100 serieis owners playing guide. The harmonic drawbars book appears to be a piece of sells litature that goes into great detail to explain why their drawbar system is far superiour to other makes presets. The owners playing guide has drawbar settings, (with vibrato and chorus settings), for many different instruments and styles of music, and even sheet music to several songs.

Her hammond catalog only had pictures and descriptions of the m-101, m-102, & m-103. In my pdf catalog it has the m-162 & m-165 listed. The style is listed as institutional, the finish as walnut and oak, production dates of Feb '65 to Jan '68, and prices of $1,660.00 & $1,710.00. Some interesting things I noticed between our two catalogs: in hers she wrote down the prices of the L & m seriesfrom the dealership, (those were the two models she was interested in because of the reverb), her price for the L-122 was $1,075 & she actually paid $1615.00 for her M-101. My catalog has the price for the L-122 $1,175 & the M-101 as $1,495.

Yes that's the 'Complete Hammond Catalouge'. My guess would be (only a pure guess BTW), that as the L122 price is fairly close, that's the price from the L122 from that particular dealer (the prices in the catalogue are only the RRP, the final price is up to each individual dealer). Most dealers would stick around the RRP though, so I'd guess that maybe she was more interested in the M101, so that price includes delivery and/or any extras to make the overall price? Just a guess, but the dealer could have marked the M101 up that much, although having that sort of price difference between the L and M doesn't look good and at the time there were tons of Hammond dealers around, so I can't imagine that would be the basic price as that would make that dealer miles more expensive than his/her competition!

[fluid69]

Yes that's the 'Complete Hammond Catalouge'. My guess would be (only a pure guess BTW), that as the L122 price is fairly close, that's the price from the L122 from that particular dealer (the prices in the catalogue are only the RRP, the final price is up to each individual dealer). Most dealers would stick around the RRP though, so I'd guess that maybe she was more interested in the M101, so that price includes delivery and/or any extras to make the overall price? Just a guess, but the dealer could have marked the M101 up that much, although having that sort of price difference between the L and M doesn't look good and at the time there were tons of Hammond dealers around, so I can't imagine that would be the basic price as that would make that dealer miles more expensive than his/her competition!

That's what I figured too. Im sure that price atleast includes taxes.

[Earnest]

Was there ever a M116? I searched Google but got no results for M116.

[fluid69]

Was there ever a M116? I searched Google but got no results for M116.

that was my main question and conclusion too. The document in question, appears to have come from Hammond. Im not sure if the warranty and registration certificate came with the organ and the dealer filled in her name and date, or if she mailed in a card and it came from hammond after the purchase. If it came with organ, Id say it was a misprint and they corrected it at the dealer ship. The serial # matches, & the M-116 appears to have been printed at the same time. The M-101 has been stamped above with a rubber stamp, and the M-116 blacked out with with the same stamp turned to to blank spaces. Another question I have, is what serial # did they switch from the ao-35 to the ao-44 reverberation amp chassis? There were two different versions of ao-44's. The service manual doesnt say what #'s they switched from the ao-35's to the ao-44's, but the switched from the first ao-44 style to the second in the late 60,000's.

But no, Ive never seen or heard of an M-116 until now. I was wondering if anyone else had.

[picothinker]

I searched, and searched before I posted. There is a USA military vehicle: "Husky: Carrier, Cargo, Amphibious, M115 and M116a (G299)". There is an M116 Howitzer as well. There's a highway in Michigan, USA, and a bus route in New York City.

A railroad buff in Oz has a section car, M116 as well.




Can you post pics of the cabinet, amp, basic internals? It could hold more clues.

[fluid69]

I searched, and searched before I posted. There is a USA military vehicle: "Husky: Carrier, Cargo, Amphibious, M115 and M116a (G299)". There is an M116 Howitzer as well. There's a highway in Michigan, USA, and a bus route in New York City.

A railroad buff in Oz has a section car, M116 as well.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12877[/ATTACH]


Can you post pics of the cabinet, amp, basic internals? It could hold more clues.

I definatly post some pics this evening. I didnt get it out of the van until yesterday around 4pm. I spent the rest of the evening playing it and checking it out. hehe The only thing I can actually find wrong with it is the vibrato seems to no be working. I think its probably the scanner. I can jear a change in the sound when I flip the switchs, mainly the chorus, but it doesnt seem to have and pitch variation or movement of any kind.

[jdoc]

I used to ride on those motor cars, looks like a Sylvester but could be an old Fairmont

I definatly post some pics this evening. I didnt get it out of the van until yesterday around 4pm. I spent the rest of the evening playing it and checking it out. hehe The only thing I can actually find wrong with it is the vibrato seems to no be working. I think its probably the scanner. I can jear a change in the sound when I flip the switchs, mainly the chorus, but it doesnt seem to have and pitch variation or movement of any kind.

[fluid69]

Uurrgghh! Sorry guys, Ive been trying to upload some pics of the organ for two days. Ive been having problems with the uploader on my phone and my desktop. I even tried from the computer at work. I guess I could fire up my photobucket acct, but that sounds like work. Has anybody else been having problems?

Anyways, it seems to be just a standard m-101 as far as I can tell. Im sure its just a misprint, but still interesting none the less. The thing that I find most perplexing is the fact that it was on the front and the back of the warranty card. surely there are more M's with the same misprint. I wonder what method of printing they used.

Back to the vibrato, Ive been reading some info on the forum and in the service manual. The service manual has a page on vibrato trouble shooting. The only option it gives for thw syptoms the M has is the bearing being frozen on the shaft and gear that drives the scanner. Honestly, thats what I thought it was at first, but after reading on the forum, here's my action plan. Im going to swap the 6au6 and the 12au7, Ive spares of both, plus there's two more in the amp. next, if that doesnt work, Ill break out the contact cleaner. If that doesnt work, Ill try to spin the shaft by hand. Has anybody done this before? I read a post about it last night, but it wasnt very clear on the exact steps, and now I cant even find it of course. Any input on this would be great. Next Ill check r9 & r10, and maybe r13 and r14. I think thats the resisters it was. I read several threads where those were the problems, but I didnt have my schematics in front of me. And if none of those work, Ill dig a little deeper, (or alot deeper I guess haha).

[fluid69]

Well good news/bad news! Good news is I figured out what was wrong with the vibrato. The bad news is that the scanner is froze up. Its going to have to be rebuilt. I could barely get it to turn with my finger. Im not sure its worth fooling with since I jam my leslie, but Ive heard the chorus is awesome and the chorus sucks on my L-122. Opinions?

Edit: whats the difference between chorus and celeste?

[fluid69]

I found this page that seems like a pretty well written step by step:

http://www.dannychesnut.com/Music/Ha...ammondTech.htm

[Jim Dep]

Did your scanner tub have any oil in it? The little felt pad inside is supposed to stay only "moist" with oil, being careful not to over oil it.

The scanner on my M 102 wasn't working when I first got it a year and a 1/2 ago. It was froze, just like the TWG. It needed oil and then a good zapping with 2 volt batteries to drive back the evil dendrites.

It works beautifully now, however periodically needing an occasional ZAP.

My M102 is a 1964 model and it has the AO-44 reverb unit.